'Bird Beater' question

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This topic contains 9 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Zigzag Sky Zigzag Sky 3 months ago.

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  • #98562
    Profile photo of Zigzag Sky
    Zigzag Sky
    Participant

    Just setting up a small TV studio using an SQ5 and a couple of D-Snakes and am trying to set up a ‘bird beater’ process which is where a mix is sent to a destination ‘pre fader’ but muted when the fader is opened. In this case this is to set up ‘lazy talkback’ to a Producer from the presenter mics.

    The process is that when the presenter mics are faded down on the main mix, the Producer receives their pre-fader audio but once the mics are opened on the main mix, the feed to the Producer is muted.

    I’m still learning the ins and outs of the mixer but can’t find a way to do this easily.

    Anybody got any ideas?

    Thanks,

    Brian

    #98563
    Profile photo of KeithJ A&H
    KeithJ A&H
    Moderator

    Hi Brian,

    There is no internal way of achieving this, though it would be relatively straightforward to achieve with the addition of a BomeBox ( https://www.bome.com/products/bomebox ) and Bome’s MIDI Translator Pro ( https://www.bome.com/products/miditranslator ), or a connected computer running a MIDI translator.
    The BomeBox firmware includes auto-connection to A&H digital mixers over the network port and can load translation files from MIDI Translator Pro, so this would be a neat stand-alone solution.
    You may find that you are ok with a computer based solution however, and for testing at least, you could use Bomes MIDI translator classic.

    The SQ sends and receives MIDI messages for both send levels and mutes, so you’d be looking to add some logic in the translator that says ‘when main (or other) send level is above x, mute y. when main (or other) send level is below x, unmute y’.

    If you need further help with this, please contact us using support.allen-heath.com.

    Hope this helps!
    Keith.

    #98564
    Profile photo of Zigzag Sky
    Zigzag Sky
    Participant

    Thanks for the quick response Keith.

    I’ve looked into the solutions you suggest and I agree that the BomeBox with MIDI Translator Pro looks to be the neatest for a permanent solution.

    I’ll have a play with the Bome MIDI translator classic and a PC to get the hang of things and try out the idea.

    Brian

    #98568
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    Keep in mind I’m not a MIDI programmer but this company makes
    MIDI to contact closure interfaces.
    http://midisolutions.com/products.htm

    Getting that programmed correctly you could use the contact closure to
    control a relay opening and closing the physical output line of the prefade mix.

    Kind of like broadcast mixers that had the que detent position that closed
    a switch at the bottom of the fader travel.

    #98570
    Profile photo of Zigzag Sky
    Zigzag Sky
    Participant

    Thanks Mike,

    I remember the microswitches at the bottom of the old quadrant faders during my early years at the BBC!

    I’ll look at the relay box from Midisolutions but it does then involved making up an additional hardware box to accommodate the switching of the XLR feed to the lazy output which may be less elegant than the solution proposed by Keith.

    #98583
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    I’ll look at the relay box from Midisolutions but it does then involved making up an additional hardware box to accommodate the switching of the XLR feed to the lazy output which may be less elegant than the solution proposed by Keith.

    That would require a hardware DIY project and an external DPDT relay to open and close the XLR line.

    I found the Midisoultions equipment when looking at an install project that would have needed some contact closure to MIDI control. The install never happened so I never got
    the chance to set up and program any of their equipment.

    #98618
    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    Why not doubling the channel with the opposite routing and switch between them?

    #99253
    Profile photo of Zigzag Sky
    Zigzag Sky
    Participant

    Quick follow up…

    BomeBox and MIDI Translator Pro software have been purchased and I’m working my way through how to configure a process to do the task…

    Very powerful little units these, I’m sad I hadn’t come across them before as they are a bit of a Swiss Army Knife when it comes to MIDI and would have solved a lot of workflow issues on previous projects.

    #99255
    Profile photo of ioTon
    ioTon
    Participant

    I love them too…

    Here I’ve done a Faderwing without PC: https://community.allen-heath.com/forums/topic/faderwing-for-sq#post-98456

    I love it 😉

    #99652
    Profile photo of Zigzag Sky
    Zigzag Sky
    Participant

    Final update…

    Successfully set up the BomeBox and wrote a translation file including a couple of simple rules using MIDI Translator Pro as suggested by Keith. All works really well and the client is pleased.

    Basically I read the fader position of the talent Mic and if it’s above a certain value, I mute the mix to the Producer. If the talent Mic is faded out then the system un-mutes the mix to the Producer.

    It was good to see that the BomeBox supported the SQ5 straight out of the box with no configuration required, connected it to the network and the SQ5 was discovered immediately.

    Thanks for the help.

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