Video Sync w/Dante and iLive Rig

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  • 2013/03/08 at 11:28 pm #23657
    Profile photo of CMattECMattE
    Participant

    I realize this is a bit, okay quite a bit, off topic but I’m entering a new world and hope someone here can point me in the right direction. We record our church service multi-track via Dante into Reaper. I was approached about recording video also. The church already has a Sony HDR-AX2000 camera. I’m trying to figure out how would be best to sync this up. I use Pro Tools to mix the services already, and have the CPTK if that helps. I haven’t used Pro Tools to record because it has a 32-channel limit. We could use Pro tools if that helps. We normally record about 20-24 channels.

    However I’m at a loss as to what else we need. From my research Sony makes a version of our camera with SMPTE inputs. I think, if we had that camera I could get something like the MOTU micro express to output SMPTE. Then use that to sync up the audio and video. The camera does have XLR inputs, and my understanding SMPTE is just an audio based signal anyways. So could I still do that?

    Finally is there some software that would allow us to record both video and audio simultaneously? I’m in the process of downloading demos of Sony Vegas, Final Cut, Avid Media composer and anything else I can find to try. Just wondering if anyone else is doing something similar and what gear they’re using?

    If not can someone point me in a direction to ask these questions?

    Thanks

    Matt

    T112/48, MacBook Pro, D-link DIR-815, iPad 1 w/mixpad, Dante card feeding a Mac Mini w/DVS.

    2013/03/12 at 12:50 am #33416
    Profile photo of CMattECMattE
    Participant

    Okay I’m getting some things figured out. In all likely hood we’ll probably go with plural eyes and sync later. However I’m still looking at options. And most have us syncing the converter clocks of the camera and Dante/iLive. The biggest issue here is we’d have to use the camera’s clock as it has absolutely no means of syncing to an external clock. Which has led me to realize, what would be the best way to sync an ilive to an external clock? It doesn’t appear that spdif is an option? It appears the motu HDX-SDI could sync to the camera and then output a clock signal, but how do I get that into the iLive? Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

    Matt

    T112/48, MacBook Pro, D-link DIR-815, iPad 1 w/mixpad, Dante card feeding a Mac Mini w/DVS.

    2013/03/16 at 2:05 pm #33474
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Inactive

    Hi Matt,
    Sounds like you are talking about two different things: positional reference (TimeCode) and Timing Reference ( Clock)
    For positional refereence you would need to have a TC master. Could be the DAW or the Camera ( if available) or a stand alone generator.
    For the DAW. You could use this:
    https://www.motu.com/products/midi/mtpav_usb/midi.html
    But i have not tried using this unit and Dante in the same software. But there should be no reason why it wouldnt work.
    If you use the MOTU, you should be able to “slave” the camera off the DAW, however, i would recommend using a stand alone generator and feeding both camera and DAW.
    That way you dont risk loosing sync if one of the units crash.

    Maybe i’m missing something that the other experts herre can point out, but im not sure you need to worry about clocking both (timing reference) as they would be independently edited and recordered on different devices with no digital audio connection between them.
    In the case you do need clocking, this may work:
    https://www.grassvalley.com/products/advc_g4

    My2cents

    Gil Parente
    Design & Integration
    Entertainment Arts, Inc.
    iLive 176, T112
    iDR48 , iDR16, iDR10
    Multiple iPads
    Dante
    Etc..

    2013/03/16 at 2:09 pm #33475
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Inactive

    BTW.. The only easy way to Sync an iDR48 to external clock would be with a MADI card. You could clock it off PortB (Dante) but you would still need another Dante device in the system with some sort of external sync connection in order to have a external clock master.

    Gil Parente
    Design & Integration
    Entertainment Arts, Inc.
    iLive 176, T112
    iDR48 , iDR16, iDR10
    Multiple iPads
    Dante
    Etc..

    2013/03/18 at 1:40 am #33485
    Profile photo of CMattECMattE
    Participant

    I appreciate the replies and will look into that box. And yes I realize I am talking about two different things. My understanding is you can use smpte position (for my purposes ltc) and there is also the sampling clocks of the video and audio recorders. If either can be linked it should be usable, but doing both makes it the best possible. And maybe far beyond necessary for our purposes. The problem I’m having with ltc, is what do I use to sync them back together in the end? I’ve found a video showing how it’s done with avid media composer. But selling the powers that be on $2500 editing software is another task. ;) if I could sync sample clocks, at least from what I’ve read, once you bring the two files together and “nudge” the audio into place it should stay synced throughout. But adding a madi card or dante interface just to clock with seems overkill also. In the end the app plural eyes may be our best bet.

    However if anyone else can explain something better I’m all ears. And thanks again for the help thus far. :)

    T112/48, MacBook Pro, D-link DIR-815, iPad 1 w/mixpad, Dante card feeding a Mac Mini w/DVS.

    2013/03/18 at 12:20 pm #33492
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Inactive

    Hi Matt
    It could be easier than you think.
    Just stripe LTC to both. Edit the video in whatever editor you’d like. Than you should be able to import that video into your DAW locked to time code. Everything should line up. Than you can export your audio back to the video editor for “mastering”.
    Let me see if i can find some stuff on this.

    Gil Parente
    Design & Integration
    Entertainment Arts, Inc.
    iLive 176, T112
    iDR48 , iDR16, iDR10
    Multiple iPads
    Dante
    Etc..

    2013/03/18 at 1:42 pm #33495
    Profile photo of CMattECMattE
    Participant

    Okay. I hadn’t thought about it that way. I was assuming I’d have to line them up on the video editor. I’ve been sending out ltc (audio) into one audio channel of the camera. The problem may be the camera we have doesn’t have an actual ltc input. It’s the consumer version and not the “pro” version. Which does have ltc inputs and word clock inputs also, if I remember correctly. Knowing what I know now, I’ll try and make sure any additional cameras we may get have those features. Anywho I’ll keep playing around and see what I can figure out.

    Thanks

    Matt

    T112/48, MacBook Pro, D-link DIR-815, iPad 1 w/mixpad, Dante card feeding a Mac Mini w/DVS.

    2013/03/18 at 10:43 pm #33499
    Profile photo of Anonymous
    Inactive

    Yeah,
    The way i described would prob be the easiest for you.
    If your camera does not have LTC inputs, then your life gets harder.
    Pro cameras will have TC input as well as Ref input ( not word clock).
    The ref in is for BlackBurst or Tri-sync signals. Which are all frame based timing signals.

    Gil Parente
    Design & Integration
    Entertainment Arts, Inc.
    iLive 176, T112
    iDR48 , iDR16, iDR10
    Multiple iPads
    Dante
    Etc..

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