- This topic has 17 replies, 3 voices, and was last updated 12 years, 1 month ago by
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I think you may run into two problems:
– you can’t route groups to other groups
– you will run out of mixes if you try and do it using groups and then into matricesIs there a reason you need to subgroup the drums/instruments/vox before grouping them again to the band group? In our church application we route all instruments directly to the BAND group and then use DCAs to control levels of multiple inputs (so although all the routing is to the BAND group, we have granular control of drums, vocals etc via DCAs).
Unless you need to do some processing or routing specifically on those sub-sub-groups, DCAs are your friend
I don’t really need to do it that way, but I’d like to if possible. The main reason is so that I could set up compressors on the groups to keep the mix together a bit more easily. Everything but the lead vocal would be compressed in sub groups, keeping the vocal on top. I could take a bit of high mid out of the INSTR group for vocal clarity etc.
I don’t think I’m trying to route a group to a group, but I may have worded it so that it looked like I am. I actually tried that earlier tonight and came up with the above post as an alternative. “BAND” is actually LR, but renamed.
I was planning on using DCA’s for level control on “groups” of inputs but I’d like to be able to do the compression thing. eg. more aggressive threshold on instruments than vox. It’s not at all an issue if I can’t but it may make it a bit easier to mix if I have to leave someone else to mix a music service. (or it may have the opposite effect [
])I also need to do mixes for 4 monitor wedges, an overflow room and the USB recording. The overflow and recording could be fed from the same mix bus as the PA so that shouldn’t really be an issue.
I’m only planning on using 3 mono FX sends buses and inserting anything else. eg reverb on BGV group. Which reminds me, I haven’t actually tried that, can you insert an FX processor on a group?
To put all this in perspective less than 6 months ago we were using an 8 input analog console with no outboard, and it sort of worked. [
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We wern’t really doing any music though, so no wedges, and not feeding the overflow room.[
]Thanks,
Chris
Thanks for taking the time to do that Scott. [
] At a quick glance it seems pretty good. I’m heading out soon so I’ll take a better look at it later on.Chris
That looks like it will do the job Scott, I’ll be able to set that up on the console tomorrow night if it works out.
(Hint: This is why we need an editor) [
]What I would like to do for the overflow/recording Matrix mix is to have a room mic come up in this mix whenever the band is playing. This is to get congregation singing into the mix. My idea for doing this is to assign the room mic to the matrix post fader and assign the room mic input fader to the same DCA as the band group (LR). Ganging would work too but I would have no relative level control between band and room.
Is it possible to assign a DCA to just a bus send from an input rather than the actual input? Eg. have a DCA that turns up the lead vocal in the Delay send mix but not in FOH.
Thanks,
Chris [
]I ran into an interesting problem trying to route:
INPUT > GROUP > LR > MATRIX,
Assigning an input to the matrix will also assign it to LR, and vice versa. Am I doing something wrong in my attempts to assign this or is it supposed to work like this?
I currently have it set up with 5 stereo subgroups, 2 stereo matricies and 2 mono matrices. No LR needed. [
]Chris
The GLD seems to be able to assign an input directly to a matrix, I’ll confirm this next time I’m down. I’m currently using a DCA in the way you describe, I have it assigned to the delay send master.
I think I used:
5 stereo groups (drums, instruments, vocals, speech, media)
4 mono auxes (monitor wedges)
2 stereo matrix (PA, overflow room)
2 mono matrix (T-loop, spare)
Can’t remember FX, probably whatever mix buses were left over.We’re still in the middle of the upgrade so there isn’t really a regular input list yet.
I’d attach my show file if there was a way to. [
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That could be a cool addition to the forum actually, being able to do that… [8D]My email address is uxtxixlxixkxexyx@gmail.com without the x’s. If you email me I can reply and attach the show file.
Chris
I’ve been pouring over the block diagram for the GLD, and I don’t see any provision for sending a channel (via assignment) directly to a matrix. The only way I can see it’s possible is through inserting it in the matrix or patching it in through the external input. Also, I see that you have the Main set to “None”, which is typically reserved for using the console to run monitors. Are you able to pan your channels without there being an LR buss in place? Where are your FX returning to, and how are you routing them to the PA and Overflow Matrices?
Thanks for giving me your email, but I don’t have any way of looking at the show file until an editor is created. I don’t actually have a console yet, and it will be some time before that materializes. Also, please don’t think I am trying to tear your setup apart, I’m trying to learn right along with you about the different ways to set this console up.[
] I know that workflows tend to be different from one audio guy to the next depending on their needs.Thanks,
ScottIt’s a bit confusing about the matrix. You can’t do it but it makes it look like you can. If you have LR “MIX”ed and then you “MIX” a matrix, the assign function on the inputs (hold assign and press mix) remains functional for LR. I’d have assumed that if you’ve “MIX”ed a matrix you would be seeing assigns to that matrix, but apparently not…
I found this out using the editor, thanks for that tip. [8D]
I’m currently just using inputs, groups, LR and it’s working fine. It’s probably going to be a lot easier if I just use LR for it’s intended function. [
]Current plan is to not do the overall band group as it will make things much easier. I’ll run all the music through groups, and maybe speech too, media can go straight to LR.
This will be LR MIX. I’ll feed the left and right of the PA from a matrix creatively named PA LR. I’ll do any GEQ etc. for the PA on that matrix so I can send a non GEQ’d version to the recording, overflow room etc.
I’ll have a play around in the editor with setting up the “automatic room mic when band plays” thing.
Chris
That’s very close to what mine is turning out to be aswell.
Is that ADT on a send for the weaker singers? [
] I might have to try that.How do you normally set up sends to recordings and other rooms? My current idea is to feed the recording and the overflow room from the same stereo matrix. This would get the LR mix and the room mic “group” (only one input in this group but it’s the only way to get it to the mtx) I may put talkback in the other group if I want to talk to the overflow room and not the PA.
In the UK we have to have an induction loop to provide a direct feed to hearing aids. I’m feeding this off a mono matrix because I doubt the people in the room want to hear the room mic
I could get away with giving this one side of the LR if I was short on buses some day.https://www.healthyhearing.com/content/articles/Technology/T-coils/45927-Hearing-aids-in-loop
Chris
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