Hooking up a submix for live stream audio

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This topic contains 13 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Mike C Mike C 10 months ago.

Viewing 14 posts - 1 through 14 (of 14 total)
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  • #92731
    Profile photo of Cindyev2
    Cindyev2
    Participant

    Hi Everyone. I have a QU PAC as the only mixer for our church sound system. I control the sound in church via iPad. Our new video tech wants me to add a mixing board on to the system so that he can have separate control of the audio going to the live stream on his computer. I am stumped on how to do this. Could anyone give me some suggestions? Thank you so much!

    #92732
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    Hi Cindy.

    There are many ways you could do this. More info would help to suggest the best direction.

    Do they want a completely separate mixer for control of everything, or would control of each channels’ levels be enough? Are you currently using all of the available mixes & groups?

    How many channels do you use in the church & how many need to be used in the recorded mix? If the total is fewer than the QuPac has available, it may be possible to split it in two.

    Do you own any of the expansion boxes (AB168, AR2412, AR84)?

    How much budget do they have for this?

    #92733
    Profile photo of Cindyev2
    Cindyev2
    Participant

    Hi MarkPAman. Thank you for your quick reply.
    Here’s what I have…

    #92734
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    I see nothing?

    #92735
    Profile photo of Cindyev2
    Cindyev2
    Participant

    Well, the photo didn’t upload. It’s a QU PAC 32 with an AR2412.

    They only want control of the levels.

    We use about 24 channels for the church church, but 8 of those channels come through a snake from the choir loft. He only needs an one channel for the snake. He doesn’t need to control those levels individually.

    From the main QU, he wants to be able to control about 5 or 6 channels.

    He already bought an 8 channel mixing board and tried patching it into our system with disastrous results. So, we have that piece of equipment.

    Thank you SO much for your help.

    #92736
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    OK

    I guessing from that, that you can’t (easily) run all the inputs he wants from the AR2412?
    Also, as he wants levels only, splitting the desk is not really needed.

    I’m hoping you have a mix (or group that can be turned into a mix) available?

    So let’s say that mix 9&10 can be used for the video, and can be connected (possibly via his desk) to his computer.

    You could give him control with the:

  • Qu-You app an a phone (though this is not really what it’s designed for)
    The Qu Control app on an iPhone or iPad, which you could set up with the level controls for up to 15 channels on one page.
    The Qu Pad app on an iPad, which you could lock down to prevent him accidentally doing something to your settings.
  • Qu Series Apps

    If you group the choir mics, then that group can be used for his mix to reduce channel numbers – same goes for any other groups you may use.

    I’m not sure how well I’ve explained all that – any questions, please ask!

#92738
Profile photo of volounteer
volounteer
Participant

@Cindyev2

You will have problems.

Either he has to run the board and you hope the FOH sounds good on LR
or you give him a mix and you control the sound levels.

Our church sends a mix named <D> but physically from mix5/6 on the Qu32 board.
The sound is set up for the live streaming and then left alone.
But if they want a change he asks and we hit layer for mix5/6 and adjust faders for him.
Then unhit mix and back to normal operations.

Not sure about the ipad approach. If you can select mix and then adjust faders then he could do it that way.
But you risk changing FOH if they do it.

If you do not have the Qu then you could add one for streaming but you would have to get the inputs into it somehow.

Looking at the block diagram for the Qu it might be possible to use a TS cable also in the input of an XLR to feed that XLR mike intput to another mixer for the streaming to use. So if the QuPac input is the same then that is a kludgie possibility which should work.

#92739
Profile photo of Cindyev2
Cindyev2
Participant

Thank you so much for that. Using the mix outputs is a good idea.

If I understand correctly, all I have to do is create a few mixes (some could even be just one channel, right?) And use the outputs on the back of the QU to hook up to his mixing board?

#92741
Profile photo of Cindyev2
Cindyev2
Participant

Volounteer,

Agreed. We have problems.
We tried hooking up the USB output, but there were some serious distortion issues. The only way we could eliminate the distortion and noise was by using a splitter on the L main out. I had this running through an audio box to his computer, which was working. He complained that there was background noise/static and that the only way to eliminate it was by running the sound though a separate mixing board. He insists on having a separate bmixing board for his live stream. No amount of talking him out of it is working. Now, this connection to his board is causing FOH probs!

#92742
Profile photo of Cindyev2
Cindyev2
Participant

By the way, he can’t control FOH because…
A) he is in the back room running the live stream and
B) I need to be able to turn mics on and off in the loft.

#92744
Profile photo of volounteer
volounteer
Participant

@cindyev2

The best way is a mix but he wont be able to use the faders if he is back there and you are in a loft unless he has a way to do it from an ipad.

We have ours side by side in the balcony so they can talk in person so if livestream needs an adjustment then the FOH changes their mix for the livestream to use.

We had problems with the audio box too but that was because the camera mike was on. So was the pc mike. Turn them off and no problem. But we did feed the audio box from the mix not the usb.

We have a separate PC that gets the camera video and the Qu audio then adjusts it all in some magic software like livestream or OBS then sends it to the radio station and utoob via the internet.

#92750
Profile photo of Cindyev2
Cindyev2
Participant

Thank you for your help, Volounteer.
Sounds like you’ve got it working out well at your church.

There are probably as many different ways to live stream as there are churches. But, that seems to be the nature of sound too. I have not yet run across two sound engineers who would configure a system the same way.

I wish your model of having both the live-stream and the FOH audio controlled from the same place, but it’s already been hardwired a different way.

Thank you for taking the time to help me with this. I really appreciate it.

#92751
Profile photo of volounteer
volounteer
Participant

@cindyev2

this is our third set up.

first was outside and a learning experience about streaming.

then some real fiascoes inside until they settled on this layout.
those were all done in the balcony together with a new laptop and livestream software.
they tried obs outside but had some pc caused type problems with it.
i would prefer obs but livestream seems to be working.

new guy doing the video did not talk to the old guy who did it nor the sound folks who supplied sound for the video that was edited and posted previously before live stuff happened.

i could have told him what his major problem was but i was not involved. back in the record edit post days we discovered the mike in the camera was a big problem and had to be off but canon has no way to do that on the camera. but he was up to his alligators trying to learn everything including all the livestream operation so the mikes were not a big concern to him until they failed big time with echoey noise over the real sound.

we also fed the static recording with a matrix out which seemed to work okay when the mike was turned down to zero in the camera.

but no way to tweak stage mikes for the matrix so they moved to a mix.
and they also had to discover, the hard way, that they need to block the pc mike not just the camera mike. plugging in headphones seems to do that on the pc. and the software had a way to ignore the canon mike and just use the mix we gave them.

maybe if the operator had focused on getting it set up right at sound check time instead of flitting around talking to people downstairs they could have avoided the early problems.

but they still need mike tweaks at times on various channels so best to have them next to each other where they can communicate and do it fast/easy.

I really wish we had a good AGC for all the mikes so we would not have the big DR problem requiring tweaks.

#92753
Profile photo of Mike C
Mike C
Participant

It sounds like you too many helpful hands that lack the knowlege of interfacing sound equipment.
Your noise a static issues on the live stream and on the main system most likly is from not using isolation transformers between the video system and the mixer outputs.

What kind of audio inotus are you going into for the video equipment, If it’s an 1/8 inch stere mic input those are not directly able to connect to a line level XLR output.
You can use the mixers rear USB output to send audio into a computer, it another topic on setting that though.

Yes two discrete isloated mixers that are fed from a spitter system, one for the main mix and another
in an separate room for the video mix is the full blown way to do it though few have the resources to do it.

With the mixer you have you can effictively create a mix for live steaming, pick an unused mix, set it to POST FADE, start
off with all the channel mix sends for that mix all set to unity, on the spoken word input channels bump those up higer.

As Mark said/suggested to allow for somewhat easy remote mixing for the live stream try the QU You App. That App will allow
someone to adjust the mix balance and adjust the overall mix output processing. Using that app they can not make changes that
would affect anything on the main mix. The person will need a way to monitor the audio on that mix.
I have set up a couple system doing that very thing.

All that said I think you are at the point of needing to bring a qualified person to help you get your system set up and straighten out.

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