[shuahughesParticipant]

looks interesting, can’t wait to learn more!

Not sure how a 16 channel mixer is competition for a 32 channel mixer though…. just saying.
16 runs out super quick, even with 3 stereo channels.

[shuahughesParticipant]

quote:

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Originally posted by tk2k

This thread is filled with a lot of people who have forgotten where iLive came from. I purchased a T112 for ~8k and that was amazing. When iLive launched the surfaces cost ~20k + and iDR.

To ask for a 3k surface is just silly. If you can’t afford it, you can’t afford it. Buy a GLD instead.

Same with Mixpad. It’s downright cheap.

iDR-48, T-112, Mixpad
College

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Where it came from is inaccesible to smaller churches and schools.
Any business which runs based on where it came from is in serious trouble.

The digital market is changing very fast right now and A&H are perfectly placed to capitalise on it big time….
iPad app should be a value added service, not a self funding product.
Every other company I have checked out that are in this market are offering free iPad apps.

Sadly, one of the churches who was very keen on the iLive system I proposed to them , is now leaning heavily toward an X32….

It just a part of the puzzle, but honestly which costs more, providing a free app, or missing out on MixRack sales….?

[shuahughesParticipant]

You are assuming only one iPad license is required.

I agree that it depends on wether A&H want to be in the smaller market.

[shuahughesParticipant]

I get your point MillSt, but you have missed mine.

The iPad app being free only sacrifices surface sales if you have that size budget to begin with.
I’m talking from the perspective of someone buying multiple small sub 10K systems.
I can get the Roland M200i so I have surface and iPad.
Or a PreSonus Studio Live but have to have a Laptop connected all the time…yuck
Or an X32, or an analogue system etc….

An iDR16 or iDR32 with Laptop setup and iPad control is an amazing solution.
It would compare much more favourably if the iPad app were cheaper and had these extra features.

A&H may loose a few surface sales, but my experience says those who want a surface still want a surface. The iPad or Laptop only market is different.
Maybe some surface owners do a small gig here and there without the surface, but they will still own one.

By not having the app free or cheaper, and adding the features I listed above, A&H are missing out on what I believe could be a big market. A much more significant chunk then the few potential surface sales missed. Apple could have worried about iPad sales eating into their laptop sales, but instead they made an amazing iPad product which way more then offset the decrease in Laptops sold!

You keep saying you get what you pay for.
That’s true, but I don’t believe you understand what my market segment is looking for.
A&H have the opportunity to take on the small market head on and thrash the opposition if only they would sieze the moment.

[shuahughesParticipant]

The Roland M200i iPad app is now on the app store:
https://itunes.apple.com/au/app/m-200i-remote/id588276040?mt=8

and here’s the Roland page:
https://www.rolandsystemsgroup.com/products/100117

Now, to be clear, I am still recommending iLive to my church groups.
I just wish A&H would fix a few key issues:
MixPad – overpriced, scene control, head amp control, patching control, Dual MixRack
Tweak – GUI is horrible, basic features are great, just horrible layout
Editor – again features are great, but the GUI is so ugly. It feels like something from the 90s
the way the windows open, close, resize and scroll is not user friendly or fast

Also nice to have on the MixPad app would be SMAART type tools.
Either using the iPad mic, or using an existing measurement accessory.
The RTA is useful for feedback, but not system tuning.
the iPad and iPhone apps like AudioTools or Signal Scope are incredible, if these sort of tools can be integrated into MixPad than a premium price is definitely justified.

Note: PreSonus has introduced some SMAART tools into it’s StudioLive editor software.

[shuahughesParticipant]

quote:

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Originally posted by Lieven Dewispelaere

HI, I am in the market to buy some secand hand iPad’s to use as personal monitor mixing.
The only problem is that i use a IDR16 with a XDR16.
For the moment the Mixpad, Onemix can’t see the XDR inputs.
I want to now , as i can buy them now cheap, will this function be possible in the near future?
A&H ?? I don’t want to buy IPad’s and One Mix apps to find out that this wil never be usable.

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+1 I would also love to hear an answer for this!

[shuahughesParticipant]

quote:

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Originally posted by Detonator

Shuahughes –

Perhaps you could fill us in with YOUR experience with the Roland m200-i app… I couldn’t find a download for this app, would you be so kind to provide a link… Maybe you could direct us to a FULL listing of the capabilities of the app, I’ve searched & just got some sketchy info, no details, just a few general parameters… (I was told by Sweetwater here in the US that the consoles haven’t been shipped yet…)

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A very reasonable request.
The roland app is new, so details may be hard to find.
Note that I haven’t personally used it.

Mike Sessler at https://churchtecharts.org/ did a fair review of the Roland M200i, Behringer X32 and PreSonus 24.4.2
It is in 4 parts:
https://churchtecharts.org/home/2012/12/14/digital-mixer-comparison-m200i-x32-studiolive-2442pt1
https://churchtecharts.org/home/2012/12/17/digital-mixer-comparison-m200i-x32-studiolive-2442pt2
https://churchtecharts.org/home/2012/12/15/digital-mixer-comparison-m200i-x32-studiolive-2442pt3
https://churchtecharts.org/home/2012/12/21/digital-mixer-comparison-m200i-x32-studiolive-2442pt-4

Part 3 is the iPad app reviews.

Note that his review is targeted at churches getting into the smaller format digital mixer world. He didn’t include the iLive. Possibly because he hasn’t fully realised the power of running iLive without a surface.

For the price point, all of these mixers compete directly again an iDR16 or iDR32 with no surface.
Also, the Roland and PreSonus could be setup beside the stage much like the MixRack, and then run by the iPad from FOH, and the footprint isn’t huge, so really the “not needing the surface” argument doesn’t really apply as the price is similar.

the Roland M200i app offers HeadAmp control including gain, 48V etc.
It includes scene management, input / output patching control.
Control of FX parameters etc.

Now obviously, if you need more channels then the 24 to 32 channels these desks offer, then you are into much bigger dollars, looking to add stage racks and bigger surfaces.
So for a big rig, the cost of the MixPad app is totally justified.
I agree that iLive is choosing not to put the app cost into the MixRack prices.

But these competing small format desks have free apps and still come in below the iLive iDR pricing. Obviously this could easily lead into a “you pay for what you get” debate, and how the quality of the iLive is better than those compared here.
I totally agree, the iLive is awesome, it offers amazing quality for the price point to a small church who are happy to run without a surface.

But to this small church market, when comparing against the competition in this market, the iLive app looks way over priced. Especially seeing as the app may need to be loaded for several different volunteers iPads.

If you are a full time sound guy, large rental company, or big church with a paid permanent FOH engineer, the MixPad app price is easily justified and makes sense.
Maybe this is the only market A&H really care about….if so fair enough.
I’m just voicing the impression of the little guy, who loves the product and is actively promoting small churches in my community to install iLive as an amazingly flexible solution that offers incredible quality and great ease of use for volunteers!

Blessings,
Josh

[shuahughesParticipant]

Ok, so many here are saying the app is better than the competition.
While it is very cool, I don’t believe these people have actually looked at the competing apps.

Hows about the new Roland app for the V-mixing system?
The new M-200i lets you use the iPad to control pretty much everything, certainly much more than the iLive app.
Oh yea, and it’s free.

The Yamaha CL StageMix give head amp control, scene control and a bunch more.
Oh yea, and it’s free.

The MixPad app is fantastic, no-one is debating that.
It’s just way overpriced compared to the competition!!
Especially when you consider that iPad apps are per user!!

[shuahughesParticipant]

quote:

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Originally posted by david_herl

Will there be OneMix app for iphone / ipod touch?
At least iphone 5 & the new ipod touch with bigger screen
Plsss…. It would be awesome!!!

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+1

[shuahughesParticipant]

quote:

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Originally posted by AnnsAudio

@shuahughes, What’s Dual Rack and how does it affect your MixPad/OneMix flexibility?

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Dual Rack is when you use an ACE card in Port B to connect a second MixRack.
This offers some great flexibility, for example:
an iDR32 on stage, and an iDR16 at FOH for additional inputs.
or maybe you use an iDR32 on your main stage for the band, but then you have a brass and string section off to the side, or in a pit. Put the an iDR16 down there and save running an analogue snake.

Dual Rack also lets you operate 2 separate consols, which is great for FOH and Monitors.
Each consol can access all of the inputs from both MixRacks and you can mix them totally independently.
(one of the consols will control the pre amp gains, and the other will have digital trim control)

I work with a group of small churches who are looking to each get an iDR16 or iDR32, controlled by iPad. This provides a very user-friendly and cost effective system with great quality and control.
Every now and then, they wish to combine their gear to do a big concert.

We hire in a T112 and we are good to go.
It would be amazing to be able to be able to use iPads for monitors, however seeing as our inputs would be spread across 2 racks, the iPad won’t have access to the second rack.

Earlier this year we did a big praise concert in a local park.
We hired an iDR48 and T112.
Because we are all volunteers not professionals, we were able to split up the rolls really well.
I had my best guy on the T112, checking all the gain levels, mixing down to DCAs, and doing all the FX.
I had a second guy beside him on a laptop running the editor and mixing the foldback.
Then a third guy was out in the audience with an iPad mixing the FOH basically just on DCAs.
I also had my Laptop in the audience, along with an RTA on my iPhone doing some system tuning and EQ and keeping an eye on everything.

The iLive was so user friendly for my volunteers, and was very straight forward to have a whole team each controlling different aspects of the sound and mix.

If OneMix and MixPad can be improved to handle dual rack mode, it is a total no brainer for our churches.
Nothing else out there gives us the ability to install a small system in each church and then bring it all together. Especially not at such an amazing price point.
(remember, if we don’t need the console, even our tiny churches can afford it!!)

Also, each band can rehearse at their own church and create their own show file, and then just load it into the big system.
Using Dante we can even virtual sound check everyone.
It’s just the big finale group with everyone onstage that has to be sound checked once we get the whole system together.

Anyway, sorry for the big ramble, but you can see I really love the iLive system.
Just please, please, please give us dual rack on OneMix and MixPad….
and OneMix on iPhone, or at least an upgrade to the UI for tweak.

Thanks, Josh

[shuahughesParticipant]

quote:

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Originally posted by frozenwaffles

just one question….
why are we giving users control of the limiter?
i havent played with it yet but this is what itunes says.
can you enable and disable certain features from admin side of things?

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Yes, it appears you can disable the access to the processing from admin.

I was hoping this was going to be iPhone and iPad
For mixing your own monitor on stage an iPhone should be plenty, but the tweak app is horrible for this!!

Also, will Dual Rack mode be available for OneMix and MixPad at any stage?
I love how flexible the iLive system is, but no dual rack for iPad really limits the flexibility for me.
I assume if inputs on a slave MixRack are assigned to a DCA the MixPad will still correctly control the DCA?
But for mixing monitors we can’t see the individual channels…?

[shuahughesParticipant]

Hi Oscar,

I did an iLive hire here in Sydney, Australia in March this year.
https://www.tag.com.au/ are the Australian distributors.
I contacted Peter Bayfield at TAG, and he was super helpful.
We were doing a outdoor church concert on a very tight budget, and Peter went above and beyond the call of duty to help us out.
He provided a list of everyone who hired out the components we needed (T112 and iDR48 + Dante) and also some suggestions of people who don’t usually hire out their gear but might as a one off….

We ended up dealing with Brendan at Innovative Production Solutions.
https://innovative.net.au/
They dry hired us the rig. It came in really solid road cases with the router and everything all set to go.
The price they did for us was truly amazing.
I would highly recommend them to anyone!!
I believe they have several iLive rigs, (I know I saw at least two T112s and iDR48s)

I hope it helps.
Blessings,
Josh

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