use equaliser to put low pass filter in place

Forums Forums Qu Forums Qu general discussions use equaliser to put low pass filter in place

This topic contains 22 replies, has 10 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of  Anonymous 5 years, 10 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 23 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #48751
    Profile photo of lesouvage
    lesouvage
    Participant

    When I connect a passive subwoofer to a Lab Gruppen Lab500 amp and this amp to mix 8 of the Qu-16 mixing table with all the faders of the equaliser of mix8 above 150 Hz completely down, will that result in a well enough working low pass filter?

    #48753
    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    no

    #48754
    Profile photo of [XAP]Bob
    [XAP]Bob
    Participant

    No, the GEQ bands are quite wide.

    The PEQ could be somewhat abused for the, with a shelf doing some serious cutting, but it would still not be “right”. A crossover applied post output is the ‘correct’ solution, other options might kinda, sorta, work(ish) if you’re lucky.

    #48761
    Profile photo of airickess
    airickess
    Participant

    “Well enough”?
    While far from ideal, it won’t hurt the subwoofer or the amp.

    #48770
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    I do this all of the time into (powered 1200 watt B52’s) and non powered Subs using Lab Gruppen 4k amps
    However I cross at about 100 hz
    all faders (except 30hz left at 0db) 40 through to 100 I raise up. 125hz I leave at 0 (sometimes right off). the rest of the faders I bring down to off.

    Not technically Ideal however it works fine.
    Use your ears and be careful and actually go and look at your driver cones to make sure you are no pushing them too hard in those conditions.

    #48774
    Profile photo of [XAP]Bob
    [XAP]Bob
    Participant

    Dhak – why not the PEQ?

    #48776
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    Yes for sure I would use the PEG
    I have been using the graphics only because I come from that era where graphics were/are used to artificially create crossovers
    I’m not the only one that does this..
    I have seen some huge JBL systems use this method.
    I guess hence: people have been asking for Low pass filters on the outputs in QU.

    #48783
    Profile photo of Andreas
    Andreas
    Moderator

    I’m a little irritated about using the GEQ (or even shelving PEG) to mimic some kind of crossover. I’d not only expect issues from phase shifting, but both the PEQ and the GEQ only cut the unwanted signal by -12dB (or -15dB?, not sure). While this surely won’t hurt the subs, it may hurt your top, when trying to mimic a high pass (or low cut, however you prefer to call it).
    When talking about “large” systems there should be some bucks left to add a proper crossover (cost way less then any repair)…

    #48786
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    Irritated?
    I think we were/are calling it *low pass* filter.
    I have never had to repair any 18″subs. (only from Mr DJ’s when left unattended) 🙂
    I always run a comp/limiter after EQ on bottom end.
    Its 12 db on the QU.

    #48787
    Profile photo of dpdan
    dpdan
    Participant

    low pass filter… passes lows, cuts highs
    high pass filter… passes highs, cuts lows

    any of my subs would sound like crap if I didn’t have very specific control of the frequencies that they produce.

    I use a 48 db per octave cutoff.
    They sound wonderful!
    I can not imagine using any kind of EQ, parametric or graphic instead of proper crossover settings.

    All that being said, a man’s gotta do what a man’s gotta do 🙂
    Use what you have and use it to it’s best.

    #48790
    Profile photo of Andreas
    Andreas
    Moderator

    so I’ve done some plots of actual Qu EQ responses, after checking out the plots you’re free to decide if PEQ/GEQ could be used as a proper LPF/HPF replacement. Cutoff always set to 1kHz for better readability.
    Since only four attachments are allowed, this is split into four posts.

    1-FlatResponse: simply verify my digital loopback is clean and properly leveled
    2-1kHz-HPF: Response of the channel HPF
    3-PEQ-1kHz-HPF: Shelving PEQ simulates HPF
    4-PEQ-1kHz-LPF: Same for Low Pass

    Attachments:
    You must be logged in to view attached files.
    #48795
    Profile photo of Andreas
    Andreas
    Moderator

    5-PEQ-1kHz-LPF+1kHz-HPF: Sum when using shelving LPF+HPF as a crossover, watch the significant drop in the center
    6-PEQ-3kHz-LPF+333Hz-HPF: Sum of PEQ 3kHz LPF and 333Hz HPF, somewhat better
    7-GEQ-1kHz-Cut: Cut a single band using the GEQ
    8-GEQ-1kHz-HPF: GEQ simulates a HPF, please note the non-flat stop-band and that lowest frequencies still feed through without any attenuation. This would be a killer for any top cabinet (too much low frequency energy).
    I’m skipping the plot for the GEQ LPF, since it would be same with frequencies above 16kHz not attenuated

    Attachments:
    You must be logged in to view attached files.
    #48812
    Profile photo of Lee7
    Lee7
    Participant

    If you are going to the expense of buying a QU series board and running decent quality amps, it seems somewhat pound foolish to skip using a proper good quality crossover to extend the life of your amps/drivers and produce a better quality sound for your audience.

    Lee

    #48815
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    Very interesting Andreas, thanks. Pretty much what I expected to see.

    Sending too much HF to a sub is usually not going to damage anything, the other way around is.

    #48816
    Profile photo of GCumbee
    GCumbee
    Participant

    Just put any decent crossover on the output or sub send. Use a driverack. I have used a driverack just to get a sub output before. It is not that difficult or expensive.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 23 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic.