SQ6 – Floor Monitors Too Quiet

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This topic contains 19 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Mike C Mike C 2 weeks, 4 days ago.

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  • #98682
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    My church utilizes an SQ-6 wtih an S-Link digital snake remote. We have two Yamaha SM12V floor monitor speakers on either side of the pulpit for the worship leader and instrumentalists to hear each other better.

    We used to connect these floor monitors on an unbalanced 1/4″ cable directly to an 1/4″ unbalanced local input on the SQ-6 board, which worked fine, but we were wanting to move everything to the digital snake remote. We used an XLR balanced – 1/4″ unbalanced adapter cable, and routed the floor monitor speakers to to output 3 on the remote snake. Ever since then…..the floor monitors have been MUCH quieter.

    I’ve tried boosting the Gain and the Trim and compensating with lower slider settings. Is there anything else I can do, to boost the output from the remote snake?

    #98689
    Profile photo of Showtime
    Showtime
    Participant

    I can only find passive monitors. Do you havea link?

    #98691
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    This is exactly what we have. Is the fact that they are passive, the problem?

    Apologies for my ilteracy. I’m not a 100% expert on sound systems and amplification. I’m still learning as I go.

    #98693
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    Those monitors require the use of an external power amplifier to operate. When they were connected directly to the SQ6 there must have been a power amp somewhere in line between the mixer and speaker to get any real usable volume out them.
    To get anything you must have been plugged into an output on the SQ6 not an input, an ALT OUT maybe.
    The line out could drive a monitor a tiny bit but no where near where most people the monitor levels at! Lets hope it did not damage the output by driving it hard into an 8 ohm load.

    How were you running them prior to getting an SQ6, or did you get the monitors at the
    same time?

    If by chance you had a powered mixer before the SQ6 then the monitors could have been plugged into the mixer directly.

    #98694
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    I need to correct myself. They were plugged into an independent amp with analog in/out. The amp then was plugged into one of the local unbalanced 1/4″ ports on the SQ6 board (and before that, when we had our old analog board, it was plugged directly into it). So now I’m beginning to understand my error. What is the best solution in this case?

    SQ-6 board > to DX-168 remote snake and output (output 3 in this case, mapped via the I/O settings on the board) > to independent amp > to the floor monitors? I do have a spare amp in my A/V closet, thankfully.

    #98695
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    Ok now it’s making more sense!

    What is the amp model, does it have XLR inputs?
    If not you will need a female XLR to 1/4 TRS (tip ring sleeve) balanced adapter cable.

    After getting the amp connected to the stage box you may need to change the output patching assignments on the stage box to get the monitor mix you want to use to be on the correct output.

    Did you set up a monitor mix/aux on the SQ6?

    #98696
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    I will need to dig into my A/V closet next time I’m out there. I’m 95% sure it has XLR inputs and outputs. I do have monitor mixes set up.

    Main L/R is for my left/right house cluster.

    Mix 1 is for my floor monitors by the pulpit (the ones in question here).

    Mix 2 is for the active monitor by the piano. (works perfectly)

    Mix 3 is for the active monitor by the synthesizer keyboard. (also works perfectly)

    Mix 4 is for the output to our USB audio interface for our livestreaming computer.

    I’m beginning to put two and two together, as I learn this. The two active monitors work because they are self-powered/amplified? I’m also assuming the ohms rating has to match all across the line, including on the amp I will use for the floor monitors?

    #98697
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    It would be set to use an XLR cable from the stage box to the amp.

    It sounds like you have the mixes already inplace.
    To double check you mix 1 you could plug the mix 2 or mix 3 speaker into the
    mix 1 output on the stage box.

    Yes the active monitors have the amps built in.
    No need to worry about the “ohms”, two of those monitors will work fine
    connected to a channel on the power amp. No need to connect anything
    to the second channel on the amp at this time, assuming it is a stereo
    amp.

    What audio sources will be in the two monitors at the pulpit?
    Anything in the monitor will be easily picked by a lapel or headset mic and or
    a pulpit mic.

    #98698
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    Instruments, the worship leader’s lapel mic, and the pulpit mic. Before when we had them plugged into the old 1/4″ line going up to the main amp, we never had issues with mic pickup/feedback loops. So my assumption was it’d be the same thing here, once I get this amp hooked up.

    #98881
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    Ok. I took a look at the extra amp I have. Input is max at 10 Ohms, and output says “no more than 4 ohms impedance”. Would I be able to use this 85w amp between the Remote and the two monitors?

    #98885
    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    I think you mix up some things…
    The power amp should provide 85W @ 4 Ohm…

    What type is the power amp?
    Your SM12V should have 8 Ohm each and this makes it possible to drive two of them on one amp channel with 4 Ohm

    But the 85W are very low for stage use…

    #98898
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    It is a Samson SERVO-170 85w studio amp. I’ll post pictures of the front and back panels here shortly. Apologies if I’m a bit illiterate. I know how to operate the board. But I’m not a sound engineer.

    #98899
    Profile photo of MissouriSpartan
    MissouriSpartan
    Participant

    The attached pictures are of the front of the amp, and the rear inputs and outputs. What does 10K Ohms mean?

    What I was hoping to do was come out of one of the remote balanced outputs with an XLR > 1/4″ adapter cable into one of the unbalanced inputs on this studio amp, then out of one of the unbalanced outputs of the studio amp to the SM12Vs, with the monitors both connected in series to each other.

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    #98903
    Profile photo of volounteer
    volounteer
    Participant

    @missourispartan

    What is the SPL level at 3 feet from the monitor?
    How loud do you think it should be?

    Can you post an image of the diagram on top of the amplifier?

    If you really hooked the monitors to an INPUT on the SQ you should not hear anything on them.
    They need to hook to the OUTput of an amplifer.
    Please provide the complete exact connections for both cases you referenced.

    You do need to use an amplifer as these speakers are not powered.
    If you ran line level into them you would not hear much output as you noted.

    #98904
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    The attached pictures are of the front of the amp, and the rear inputs and outputs. What does 10K Ohms mean?

    What I was hoping to do was come out of one of the remote balanced outputs with an XLR > 1/4″ adapter cable into one of the unbalanced inputs on this studio amp, then out of one of the unbalanced outputs of the studio amp to the SM12Vs, with the monitors both connected in series to each other.

    The 10k ohms by the input jack means that the inputs represent a 10,000 ohm load to the source connected to the amplifier, in this it’s the output of your mixer.
    That will work fine, modern sound equipment connections are based on voltage interface connections where the source output is a low impedance maybe 100 ohms and the inputs on equipment is in the thousands of ohms.
    That is nothing you to concern yourself with when connection todays mixers to newer amplifiers.

    Connecting your two Yamaha speakers together is in parallel not series so the two 8 ohms speakers represent a 4 ohm load when connected to on channel of the amp.

    You do need a proper XLR to 1/4 TRS balanced cable adapter where pin 1 of the XLR is connected to the sleeve on the 1/4 plug, pin 2 of the XLR is connected to the tip of the 1/4 plug and pin 3 on the XLR is connected to the ring on the 1/4 plug.

    As mentioned 85 watts is not much power in the world stage monitors or PA systems, that said if you get to the volume needed and you are not clipping the amp your OK but you probably don’t have much headroom left.

    If you not getting any or enough level double the stage box and mixer routing.

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