Sonic Quality needs of Small channel Count applications

[HughParticipant]

Last year I advanced a request for a mini Avantis processing controller to meet the needs of discriminating small channel count users. Avantis offers 64 bus processing, that includes a d-pac option that offers complete D-Live processing including 16 DYN 8 engines, for channel counts that are smaller than the Flagship D-Live large format consoles. Apparently this indicates the fact that A&H clearly has identified the need for superior high end sonic quality in a smaller footprint than the D-Live consoles and controllers, one of the official responses to my mini Avantis request was:

“IT WOUDN’T MAKE SENSE TO PUT ALL OF THE WORK (ADVANCED DYN ENGINE & CORE) INTO SOMETHING WITH FEWER CHANNELS”.

That statement manifests an egregious miss calculation of the percentage of small channel count users, professionally employed in today’s high end SR activity. Any “Decca” orchestra recording with a few outboards and ambient micing, most all small sized acoustic ensemble performance SR, as well as high quality audio capture required for studio and live video capture will be potential buyers. Over the past 50 years I have been involved in all of these endeavors and I am certain real needs exist in the type of small desk I am requesting. I am not advocating in any way replacement of the entry level SQ5, that is a marketing home run for A&H, or encroaching upon the D-Live or Avantis larger format offerings. I am requesting two smaller footprint processing controllers: a “Flex12 and a smaller Flex8 to meet a need in the high quality. small format market.

FLEX 8; 36 bus, 48 channel, Large XCVI processing core,
1) 8 faders on 6 layers
2) 8 XLR I/Os (with a “prime I/O option”) with ample digital I/Os
3) single 15inch Avantis HD touch screen
4) 2x audio networking ports
5) 2X S-Link ports
6) hot swappable power supply
7) All of the ancillary features offered in the SQ5

Flex 12; 42 bus, 64 channel, Large XCVI processing core
1) 12 faders with 6 layers
2) the balance of features should be the same as the Flex8

IMO the marketing possibilities will be much greater than any of A&H’s big format desks but the entry level SQ5 will certainly remain their top seller for obvious reasons. The ability to consolidate and expand pure profit deep processing optional offerings and a reasonable expectation of increased sales of DX expansion boxes and prime I/Os should indicate a very logical and attractive addition to the A&H product line. Please consider these thoughts and share any input you may have!
Hugh
(I purchased a DX32 and 8 Prime I/Os and would much rather have the primes in a new Flex8 than investing $4k in a DX32 housing that I have placed in a SKB shock case that is a pain in the rump to transport. The value of a prime loaded DX32 and the SKB case would go a long way paying for a new Flex8 mini desk.)

[SteffenRParticipant]

Avantis offers 64 bus processing

No. 64 input channels and 42 buses.

In my opinion, the 8 channel variant would make no sense. Not enough faders.

[HughParticipant]

Thank you SteffenR for pointing out my Typo: The Avantis does indeed offer a 42 bus, 64 channel design with optional d-live processing including 16 DYN 8 engines.

It is very important to understand the high sonic quality, Small channel count user concept that I am concern with. The ability to optionally replace the standard d-live pres with 8 Prime $ channel I/Os will be a much better option than the current additional $4K investment in a DX32 enclosure. The flex8 is a a primary processing controller for a GX4816 or DX168 expansion stage boxes that also should feature the advanced 15inch screen from the Avantis.

The Flex 8 should be a 36 bus, 48 channel design with 8 internal XLR I/Os controlled by 8 motorized faders with 6 layers, that will provide adequate control for the 48 channel max design. There will need to be be a master fader for the external mixes and FX management protocol that we currently enjoy with the SQ5.
Hugh

[Rob TParticipant]

As interesting as something small would be, I don’t think that a 15″ touchscreen is going to get you a compact footprint. Dropping down to a 10″ touchscreen would pair better with a 9 fader unit.

But even without all new development and a new product line, something like a DX32 that adds the dLive processing core and an Slink slot would be interesting (CDM16? DM16?). Combine it with an ip8 and a touchscreen PC and you’ve basically got the Flex8

[HughParticipant]

Rob, the DX32 is not a mix rack, I have a DX32 “EXPANSION STAGE BOX HOUSING” and as such, it does not offer any processing. There are 4 ports that will accommodate 8 channels each of XLR I/Os or various other connective tools. The MSRP for this empty box is in excess of $4,000. before any of the subject 8 XLR channel strips are acquired. MSRP for the 8 Prime Pre amp channel strip is in excess of $2,500.and prime out puts apx $1,700. The D-Live I/Os in my DX168 will offer a significantly better sonic quality capture than the standard SQ I/Os IMO and their 16 pres and 8 outs carry a DX168 package price of less than $2,000. Please remember the FLEX 8 wish list is pre-dedicated to a highly customized device that offers maxed out transparent sonic quality options for less than 48 channel count users. The ability to house 8 PRIME I/Os in a new processing controller that puts the outstanding money channels right at your finger tips may be all that is needed in some performances for a significant acoustical music capture.
I am, in many ways, an old school advocate that really does believe our ears should be more important than any visual tool when shaping sound reinforcement. However, apparently the single 15+ inch HD capacitive touch screen offers much more than just a bigger screen: it represents A&Hs most advanced processing controls and IMO will be well worth the needed space required.
My vision of a “FLEX 8” has never been about a replacing the venerable SQ5 entry level marketing “home run”, it is all about efficient management of maxed out internal detailed transparency with a custom expansion stage box processing controller. What ever the ultimate footprint would be to accommodate the required features will be well worth it and, IMO, a much more attractive option than the 12 year old Digico SD11i processing controller.
Hugh

[Rob TParticipant]

Hugh,
I’m aware that the DX32 is an expansion rack that lacks processing. I was suggesting that making a version with dLive processing (think DM0 with slots for Prime cards in place of the digital expansion card slots in the current DM0) would be interesting, especially if it were kept to a compact footprint. Kit it out as one of the “Compact Touring” systems and you’ve basically got your “Flex 8”.

[HughParticipant]

Rob, Thank you for your thoughts and suggestions pursuant to the proposed Flex 8 mini processing controller. Unfortunately the subject DM0 type of retro fit to a DX32 with an ip8 for control would not be close to the desk screen processing controls that are absolutely necessary with todays working protocols. Another fader to control all of the mix outs and FX applications is very important. These issues along with a pragmatical concern about the tooling cost of producing a new Mix rack that, IMO, does not provide a visible, marketable product that meets the current need. The 12 year old Digico SD11i design is real close in it’s concept, however a long way from the scaled down Flex 8 in targeted function, price point plus it’s abundant size & weight.
Hugh

[HughParticipant]

Rob, Thank you for your thoughts and suggestions pursuant to the proposed Flex 8 mini processing controller. Unfortunately the subject DM0 type of retro fit to a DX32 with an ip8 for control would not be close to the desk screen processing controls that are absolutely necessary with todays working protocols. Another fader to control all of the mix outs and FX applications is very important. These issues along with a pragmatical concern about the tooling cost of producing a new Mix rack that, IMO, does not provide a visible, marketable product that meets the current need. The 12 year old Digico SD11i design is real close in it’s concept, however a long way from the scaled down Flex 8 in targeted function, price point plus the SD11i’s excessive size & weight.
Lets think in terms of a modified SQ5 with 8 internal d-live or optional Prime I/O’s, 8+1 faders on 6 layers, 36 bus 48 channel XCVI core processing with a single 15+ inch HD capacitive touch screen, along with 2x S-link and audio networking ports.
Hugh

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