passive v active speakers for gigging band

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This topic contains 57 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of dpdan dpdan 5 years, 8 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 58 total)
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  • #50337
    Profile photo of gilly
    gilly
    Participant

    Hi guys. Which you thi k best for a young band starting out, gigging in pubs and some outside gigs. I know active powered speakers are more expensive and apparantly sound better than passive unpowered speakers, but would be heavier and require a bit more connecting up time te extra power cables. Any experiences, good or bad,with either of these. They are considering the Behringer Xenyx x2442 desk. What wattage speakers would you recommend for this,400 W,
    Barry

    #50338
    Profile photo of jet1968
    jet1968
    Participant

    wrong forum dude

    #50339
    Profile photo of [XAP]Bob
    [XAP]Bob
    Participant

    First up I’d recommend a QU16, or a QuPac.

    Then I’d say that the extra wires for power are negligible in terms of setup (you can’t actually neglect them as the speakers won’t work if you do, but the time they take is virtually nil). You also save the cost of amps, and the cabling to the amp…

    As for power – Wattage isn’t the only consideration.
    If it’s a three person band with a Cajon and two guitars then the requirements will be fundamentally different from a 7 piece thrash metal band.

    #50341
    Profile photo of Dick Rees
    Dick Rees
    Participant


    What wattage speakers would you recommend for this,400 W,

    If you have a 100W speaker which can produce an output of 125dB and a 400W speaker which can produce an output of 125dB, which is heavier…a pound of lead or a pound of feathers?

    The answer is Zen da details…

    #50348
    Profile photo of gilly
    gilly
    Participant

    Bob
    Sorry i meant to say they are a 4 piece band with drums, bass and electric and acoustic guitars.
    And they mostly play in pubs but as they get more popular will also likely play in nightclubs and some outdoor street gigs
    Unfortunately the QU-16, though ideal, would be way outside their budjet.

    Dick
    With PA speakers yielding an average sensitivity of around 95 – 110 dB/W/m, a 100W speaker with a sensitivity of 100 dB/W/m would produce 120 dB (at 1m) at it’s max 100W input power. A 400W speaker with the same sensitivity of 100 dB/W/m would produce 126 dB (at 1m) at it’s max 400W input power. Twice as loud.

    For a 100W speaker that produces 125 dB, it would have a sensitivity of 105 dB/W/m and an efficiency of 19.95%.
    For a 400W speaker that produces 125 dB, it would have a sensitivity of just 99 dB/W/m and an efficiency of just 5%, a very in-efficient speaker….you could warm your hands off the back of it while listening with all that wasted power 🙂

    I’d prefer the pound of feathers meself 🙂 Speaking of feathers, if you dropped a feather and a lead pellet in a cacuum tube, which would hit the bottom first ??

    And Jet
    Chill out man, there’s loads of topics on this forum that are not strictly QU related. Have a nap and relax dude !!

    🙂 🙂

    #50350
    Profile photo of [XAP]Bob
    [XAP]Bob
    Participant

    For clubs and outdoors then rent in to start with.

    For Pubs then something like the Mackie 450, or (more likely given budget constraints) the Yamaha MSR400 will do a decent enough job.

    How are they monitoring?

    #50352
    Profile photo of gilly
    gilly
    Participant

    Thanks Bob, the MSR400’s look good. Don’t know re monitoring. I’d imagine they will start off without monitors with the tripod mounted speakers slightly tilted back towards them so they can hear?

    #50355
    Profile photo of Alrod
    Alrod
    Participant

    There are several things to consider. First off since this is a new band, who would own the gear if the band breaks up. One should never kid himself into thinking this could never happen. The band should work out those details in writing before spending any money.

    If you do the math there is not a huge price difference in passive versus active once you factor in the cost of purchasing amps and cabling for the passives. More time is also needed for the setup (time is money). I wouldn’t say that actives necessarily sound better than passives. That really depends on the power amp and speaker matchup. The same goes for the weight. You still have to carry the separate power amps. The weight may be easier to manage since they are separate, but over all, the weight is about the same. I prefer active for the convenience facer. Easier to manage, easier to setup/breakdown. To be continued…

    #50356
    Profile photo of Alrod
    Alrod
    Participant

    Continued…
    I have a drummer friend who owns the Behringer x2442. Yes it’s cheap, but you get what you pay for. The effects are not very good. In fact, he doesn’t use them. The EQ is a bit on the brittle/bland side. Needless to say, the drummer has a bit of buyers remorse. But if that’s all you can afford, then that’s that. Personally, since this is a startup band, I wouldn’t spend too much money until money starts coming in. The down side is that you will have to deal with a not so great PA system. Some of the venues you will be playing in will probably have a PA for you. That is a plus if the gear is decent.

    #50357
    Profile photo of [XAP]Bob
    [XAP]Bob
    Participant

    Do you have any contacts from whom you beg borrow and steal while you earn enough to buy kit – which you can then buy piecemeal, borrowing less each time?

    Monitors are useful – in ear or wedges will cost, but is better than just hearing the back of the FOH speakers… If you like the look of the MSR400s then look at the MSR100s as well, they also pack a punch above their price bracket IMHO.

    #50358
    Profile photo of mervaka
    mervaka
    Participant

    I would also argue there are more relevant forums to have this discussion in, such as PSW. If OT discussion is allowed to happen once, then it could happen many more times and dilute the whole point of these forums, ie to discuss A&H products. You’ve already stated you cannot consider Qu due to budget constraints, so I’m not sure what relevant discussion there is left.

    Also, the Watt is a metric of power, not wattage 🙂

    #50359
    Profile photo of Alrod
    Alrod
    Participant

    I am not sure if you are having a bad day or what. How about letting A&H decide what is relevant on this forum? The OP may not be in the market for a QU today but what’s to say that won’t change in the near future? I certainly had no issue responding to the questions posed.

    Let’s not pretend that this is some exclusive pompous club for the mixing elite. Why run off potential A&H customers? It wasn’t until after I joined this site that I solidified my decision to purchase a QU-16. I would now highly recommend any of the QU series boards to any startup or veteran band. The OP will see many comment like that here.

    That whole “watt” vs “wattage” comment was uncalled for. Life is too short for that nonsense. Pay more attention to that kind of stuff in school or at work where such things actually matter. I doubt very much that A&H will offer deep discounts based on grammar. Ok, stepping off the soap box now 🙂

    #50361
    Profile photo of [XAP]Bob
    [XAP]Bob
    Participant

    If we’re being pedantic then Watt is a name, watt is a unit of power, abbreviated to W.

    But life’s too short…

    #50364
    Profile photo of gilly
    gilly
    Participant

    Mr Mervaka get off your high horse and chill….I bought a Qu-24 already for our church which is how i came about this excellent forum. I am just helping out a friend and so was asking these knowledgable and helpful folks on this forum for their valued input.
    And for your information/education,wattage is a valid term used to describe an amount of power, especially electrical power, expressed in watts or kilowatts.Just like voltage and current are electrical terms used to describe an amount of volts or amps. I work as an electrical engineer,what is your job, obviously not electrical engineering. So please spare me your condensending remarks and offer some useful help ??

    #50365
    Profile photo of Dick Rees
    Dick Rees
    Participant

    Time for a little review:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watt

    The watt expresses the rate of energy conversion (or transfer) over time.

    As to your clarification regarding watts/sensitivity/SPL, that’s all well and good, but your initial statement cited only watts. Since no mention was made of desired SPL or speaker sensitivity it was not remiss to rebut by pointing out that speakers of different wattage ratings can be equal in output SPL (as you so aptly and belatedly ‘fess up) depending on sensitivity of the drivers.

    Omitting this and basing the choice of speakers solely on wattage rating is specious and misleading. You obviously know the factors involved and hence should know better than to pose the question of speaker selection based on wattage rather than SPL.

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