New dLive up and running

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This topic contains 8 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Bill in TN Bill in TN 2 years, 8 months ago.

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  • #73007
    Profile photo of Bill in TN
    Bill in TN
    Participant

    First service was yesterday. DM64 + S7000 + ULXD over Dante + 8 ME-1’s. We have made the leap to all digital from almost entirely analog. Here is some of my initial query here. First impression is WOW !! Sound is cleaner than it has ever been but maybe I made some 101 mistakes below.

    Need practical advice considering DLive system

    We had a practice Wednesday where the start was rough but eventually ironed out the kinks and everything went well. Sunday was really good and no trouble but for one thing. Some nagging occasional little static like pops. I think it was in the Dante network which was the only thing I changed adding the secondary network with Shure set redundant whereas we practiced with only primary. Some reading leads me to believe I should set to split with primary as control and audio on secondary. That may also be why I never saw the Shure integration for the ULXD in dLive. We have Firmware 1.70 so I hope this is just my mistake setting it up. Need Advice PLEASE. I do have Dante controller to set up the network and all that looked great. Did not have chance to monitor it when in use though with 9 channels running when I first heard it but it even popped with 1 channel active.

    Another thing I was really worried might be an issue is we are running a single 5e cable right now as the 6 wire I ordered had not come in and as soon as it does I’ll upgrade to redundant 6 with Ethercon. I also plan to use the same to run to either side of the stage for ME or Aviom hubs. Could this have been our little pops? The master clock is set to the Mixrack also.

    We have no more monitor world. Only a wireless device. I think we’ll get used to that but everything is also right there at FOH so 1 man can do it all if need be.

    There is ONE thing I’ve found so far I’d like A&H to make available. I want the ME to have a digital line back that I can patch to an output for in ear broadcast. We have one now and maybe two ME’s we will send back for wireless in ear. This would avoid a cable from the headphone jack so is there a way to do this or not possible with ME. Everything has it’s own address so it’s probably possible? Also I don’t know why some ME’s are green and others more of an orange color. Is that a setting I didn’t find.

    After I find that pop I’d like to know the best way to set up our old Aviom. We will use ME for Rhythm and Keys but plan to use our old Aviom for our Orchestra when they come back in a few weeks (on schedule with TN Tech University start). Can one of the other ports be used to send the 16 channels for Aviom with the right interface? Otherwise I’ll use direct outs to the existing Aviom unit.

    I have already learned so much from this forum and the discussion and will no doubt have many questions to come. We did our own install and it took many hours and more of it was the heavy lifting. New conduit from FOH to Amp room for Ethernet, Re-use of both our old sets of sequencers in series to power up/down everything, cleaning up and removing lots of old stuff and so on. Much fewer hours in actually getting channels and patching and sound running than the physical work. I really like how clean FOH is now and you should see the pile of old equipment. The only OLD stuff we are still using is our EAW 8750 processors ahead of amps and speakers.

    I would like to find someone interested in using some of our OLD stuff and we might be happy to give it to another Church that has use.
    The better stuff for example:

    2 A&H 48 channel GL 4000’s, in need of a couple very minor repairs to be 100% with 3 (1 spare) P/S.
    3 4 channel compressors
    3 dBx dynamic units
    1 2channel Behringer comp (not a fan)
    1 Rane processor 2 x 4or6 I don’t recall
    1 feedback unit (not sure who bought but never really used)
    2 single rack 6 channel mono mixers
    1 outstanding 8 channel Studio projects stereo single rack unit (might keep, love the pristine sound of the pre amp)
    1 Ashley 8 channel stereo unit (might keep)
    Some assorted EQ units and more
    SOON TO COME – 2 Yamaha MG-32 consoles

    On that last one I already have an SQ-5 in hand ready to go in our Youth center. Baby dLive so our next generation can start learning how to be digital sound engineers.

    Next up another SQ-5 or 6 for our Fellowship Hall so we can make a clean sweep.

    #73040
    Profile photo of Brad
    Brad
    Participant

    Hi Bill, great to hear you are having success.

    regarding the clicks, we were having the same issue. it turned out to be a dante clock issue. the solution in this post fixed our issue. https://community.allen-heath.com/forums/topic/dlive-dante-recording-noise

    regarding the ME return signal, we run a similar system and just plug IEM transmitters straight into the ME output; we just keep the MEs off stage. if your MEs are onstage you already have at least a cat cable running to them, so an audio cable to get back to the transmitter shouldn’t be too much of a problem. i think in other posts A&H have made it pretty clear that the ME protocol is one way only, so probably not another solution for you sorry.

    #73051
    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    Yes… it’s a clocking issue fixed with the right settings in the dante controller….
    had the same last weekend by first trying Live Professor doing reverbs over DVS

    #73159
    Profile photo of Bill in TN
    Bill in TN
    Participant

    Hello again.

    No pops with Dante now !! I had the Dante card as master but guess I did not check the sync external check box. Learning.

    I still do not get the Shure integration. So someone please help me sort this out. I have the ULXD set to SPLIT with the Primary ULXD’s into a switch and the switch to Network on the Dante card… then the Seconday ULXD’s into separate switch then Primary on Dante card. Audio is great but still no Shure control. I started with all default settings on network addressing but I think I need to have the ‘Shure Control’ network on compatible IP to the surface and mix rack? Right? I have tried putting the Dante Card and ULXD in manual network configuration and on the same network 198.162.1.xxx (different xxx each of course) to try that but the Dante card showed a network error and wouldn’t connect. I’m puzzled ?? I also plan to try the Shure Wireless Workbench on the control network ASAP.

    So many more things to learn. We’ve made a few basic mistakes but I am really still excited about where we can get to if we start dialing everything in and using more of the capability. Biggest mistake today (choir was back) was no HPF on the choir condenser mics so we got a low near subsonic rumble at some point.

    Our players are happy with ME and seem to be dialed in. I can also really hear the difference in the house especially on our drums. Some of that is finally having dedicated channels for everything.

    Thanks for any help or advice, especially with Dante!

    #73165
    Profile photo of Nicola A&H
    Nicola A&H
    Keymaster

    Hi Bill,

    Your Shure control network should connect to the dLive Network port (on MixRack or Surface), NOT the Control Network port on the Dante card.
    We’ll upload a Shure integration guide to our website shortly.

    #73300
    Profile photo of Bill in TN
    Bill in TN
    Participant

    Dante network(s) and Shure integration all working perfect now. But I didn’t do what I’ve read I don’t think ?

    Shure receivers in redundant mode.
    Primary Shure ports to first switch and M-Dante card primary.
    Secondary Shure ports to second switch and M-Dante card secondary.
    M-Dante card network port to my Router (DHCP server). If I had done this the first time around I would have been good I think.
    Primary network in 192.168.x.x range.
    Secondary network on the M-Dante (as it’s own DHCP I think) 172.31.x.x range.

    Works great and if I unplug either network there is no loss in audio.
    In the Dante Controller software I had a latency flag but it was only one receiver and it was about 1.0 ms. I cycled the power on that receiver and it happily went to ~0.5 ms. All three running receivers green!

    #73301
    Profile photo of Bill in TN
    Bill in TN
    Participant

    I meant to add I just got in my wire to upgrade the surface to mixrack connection to 6a and Ethercon and make it redundant. It’s about 160 feet run and I put it in conduit becasue of all the electrical and other things in the path. The temp 5e wire in there will be used to feed Dante to another spot so I will also see if my Dante networks complain if the redundant one isn’t identical to the primary.

    #73303
    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    The Dante doesn’t care about the cables… as long these meet the specs for fast ethernet or GBit on Gbit switches
    160feet should be ok with CAT5E

    and btw… Dante has no DHCP by default

    If you need more information and insight

    https://dev.audinate.com/GA/dante-controller/userguide/webhelp/home.htm
    https://www.audinate.com/resources/technical-documentation

    #73328
    Profile photo of Bill in TN
    Bill in TN
    Participant

    Maybe I’m still a little confused… I’m sharing in case it will help others…

    I let the secondary network do whatever it wished on it’s own but can see through ‘Controller’ it’s on 172.31.x.x and I read somewhere that is Dante’s default or native setting I thought. How all the Shure devices (set to obtain IP automatically) ended in the same range I don’t know but it works.

    On the primary network I never read conclusively or saw an example of this but I tried connecting M-Dante network port to my router in redundant mode and that is what got DHCP in 192.168.x.x to all devices on Primary side and allowed the Shure integration to work in Redundant mode. There is no mention of this in the literature I found and it did not work if I bridged the M-Dante to the extra network port on the surface. I thought this would be be same as plugging into my router for DHCP? Maybe I’ll try that again? Also before I had everything working I updated the M-Dante card firmware and I’m not sure if that made a difference or not. Another point is all current literature I have or found is iLive specific. Maybe it is well covered somewhere but I never found an example of redundant audio and control for dLive explained like this.

    Our Dante network is all on Cat 5e , maybe 6 patch cables but it is the GigaAce Network I will upgrade to redundant shielded 6a. It will be easily identified from all the plain 5e running around the building and I will also make redundant runs to either side of our stage with the 6 for things like ME or DX or even our old Aviom or anything that comes along later. I know it’s overkill but I will sleep better.

    Thanks

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