DCA FADER BLOCK not working

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This topic contains 2 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Gary HH Gary HH 1 year ago.

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  • #91502
    Profile photo of Gary HH
    Gary HH
    Participant

    I have an SQ6 (FW 1.5 ) that I am learning to use for theatre shows. Even though the global filter setting to block DCA Fader recall settings is enabled, the faders still move. I made two videos, one showing the DCA Fader FILTER set to BLOCK and when I recall a scene, the DCA’s still move. Also, I caught a moment when I faded out 3 DCA faders, recalled the next scene in the scenes list, and even though the DCA fader BLOCK is selected, the 3 DCA’s moved back up to the level I had them at before I recalled the scene.

    Here’s a link to the videos showing this problem and a copy of the SQ6 Show file.

    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/a13ibxzvzhz11ko/AABYpb2esreqgNXoj4XBSa8Va?dl=0

    #91503
    Profile photo of KeithJ A&H
    KeithJ A&H
    Moderator

    Hi Gary,

    Thanks for the show and videos, that actually all looks to be working correctly, and I’ll attempt (!) to explain what you’re seeing here.

    So you mentioned in the video that you expected the fader motors to be disconnected, and the behaviour is similar to this, but when you block anything using recall filters (Global/Scene) you’re blocking changes to the core rather than the faders. The physical controls are separate from the values in the core e.g. you can make changes to channel levels on a layer you’re not viewing with scene changes without any change to a physical fader.
    The distinction is important because of the way the control (and feedback) of fader levels works.
    So when you change layer, or mix, or change send levels for a channel you have on the current layer in any other way except by touching a fader – the level in the core changes, and also sends out a message to the fader to change position. The fader then moves to that position, and the reading from the fader is sent back to check it’s in the correct position.
    If you then move the fader, it updates the value in the core, and again, sends out that message to everywhere else displaying that value (fader, screen, Soft Rotary etc…).

    A good experiment to show how long this takes (not very long obviously) is to assign the same channel to two channel strips on the same layer and move just one of the faders. You’ll notice if you move very quickly, the fader that’s trying to follow will be just behind the one you’re moving.

    The other part of this is that the SQ is constantly storing the current state of the desk. When you make a scene change with any filter in place, it must refer to this stored data to know the state it is currently in and then apply the scene change information (non-blocked) over the top.

    So what you are doing in the video is moving the faders quickly and exactly at the point of changing scene. This means you’ve pulled the faders down part of the way when the core takes the reading of what the level is, and when it sends back out the message to tell the faders where to be, it’s sending out the level it stored from part way through your fade to -inf.

    Best practice would be to either move the faders and then make a scene change, or make a scene change and move the faders, but not both at the same time.
    You could also keep your fingers on the faders and they would take a split second to update to the new reading (-inf) but this would put strain on the motors as they would be trying to get back to that stored point for the split second they ‘think’ that’s the current state.

    The small movement of the faders when at -inf is related to all this, as to increase the life of the faders, for tolerance and to avoid damage through overshooting (SQ faders are fast!) you’ll notice the -inf marking on the surface is actually a mm or so above the maximum length of travel. All the faders are doing is jumping to their minimum actual value (-inf).

    Hope this explains it clearly enough, and enjoy the learning/playing with the SQ 🙂

    Cheers,
    Keith.

    #91539
    Profile photo of Gary HH
    Gary HH
    Participant

    HI Keith,

    Thanks for the reply.

    I find this erroneous functionality incredibly disappointing. When you mix a theatre show, there are times when you have to move faders and trigger scene changes in rapid succession.

    I don’t find this to be an appropriate functionality at all, especially if the A&H software programmers are aware of this problem…. I’ve used digital consoles since the Yamaha 02R days, and have never come across this kind of problem.

    As much as I love the sound of the console, this poor functionality means that it’s just not up to an appropriate operating standard for a theatre show. When mixing a show, I simply can’t modify the they way I move the faders and/or trigger scene change to accommodate bad functionality.

    I’m happy to clarify this further with your software engineers, but if that is what A&H deem as proper functionality, then the SQ series just doesn’t meet a minimum stand for my needs, and probably that of other theatre operators.

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