Audio delay for Live Stream

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This topic contains 18 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of SteffenR SteffenR 1 month, 3 weeks ago.

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  • #95305
    Profile photo of Eric
    Eric
    Participant

    Our church has used a software based live stream setup for over a year. The software had provision for adding in .125 ms audio delay and everything “lined up” when the video posted on Facebook/YouTube. We recently switched to a hardware based live stream setup that has no provision for audio delay. We also have an ATEM Television Studio HD that has no provision for audio delay. So what is the best way to add .125 ms audio delay into our SQ-6 output for Facebook/YouTube? (We are using two channels of analog output to connect with the ATEM.) We currently have multiple in-ear monitor mixes for our musicians and I simply have a stereo in-ear monitor mix that I use as our stereo audio feed for Facebook/YouTube. When I look into adding .125 ms delay into the Facebook/YouTube in-ear monitor mix – it seems I am adding .125 ms delay into ALL of the monitor mixes. I could be wrong about that though. Can I delay a tie line? Do I have to use a matrix for delay? Any suggestions?

    Thank You.

    #95306
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    0.125ms is very small – the equivalent of moving your head less that 2″ further from the speaker, which you’ll never notice. So I suspect you don’t mean that 🙂

    If the same mix is being used for both monitors & the streaming mix, then you should not add delay to that. But as you suggested, routing that mix to a matrix would allow you to delay it there (and give you possible extra eq & compression, which is often useful on a live stream), while leaving the monitors as they are .

    If the streaming mix is just similar to the monitor mix but on it’s own send, then any delay you apply to that send will not affect the others.

    #95309
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    Mark covered some of the routing options you could use from the SQ to the ATEM, the SQ has many options you could use.

    On the ATEM end of things are you using the ATEM control software as well?
    With the switcher connected to the software you can access full control and set up
    of the audio. The audio set up page is full mixer control for all the audio inputs.

    The analog inputs can have delay added to them.
    You could apply some compression and EQ there as well.

    The software also has many video set up options as well.
    You can download the software from the Black Magic Design website, it is a large file!

    Once you set up the ATEM with the software you do not need to open it up each time you
    use the ATEM switcher. Make sure you save the settings to the ATEM, it’s called ‘Save to start up”

    #95315
    Profile photo of volounteer
    volounteer
    Participant

    @eric

    what delay where for what reason?

    Our livestream pc software inserts a 30 second delay before sending to the AM/FM broadcast
    It also sends the stream to utoob/facebook but I am not sure whether they delay that one.

    We send the audio to the pc via an audio interface. The camera sends the video.
    the pc software syncs the audio and video together.
    I would hope that most hardware could do that syncing and delay too.

    #95317
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    what delay where for what reason?

    I’m going to say to adjust the audio to video sync timing, aka lip sync.

    Create your own slate/clapper board or get a clear close up shot
    of clapping your hands together while recording, play it back and
    watch listen for the video audio timing.

    #95320
    Profile photo of mumu
    mumu
    Participant

    i did it with the d live, 300ms was pretty much ok, BUT i ran it through a mastering comp on my workstation,it might vary there…
    to get it “perfect” i recorded a bit of video with the streaming software (my case obs), camera real close to a microphone in my hand tapping with my finger on the microphone, then used this bit of video to set it right.
    to be precicse : played back the audio on the d-live and fiddled round with the delay settings…

    #95321
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    o get it “perfect” i recorded a bit of video with the streaming software (my case obs), camera real close to a microphone in my hand tapping with my finger on the microphone, then used this bit of video to set it right.

    Yep, the ole tap on the mic works as well, also works for a quick way to set delay
    fill speakers.

    #95322
    Profile photo of mumu
    mumu
    Participant

    ps: the video is audio “redone”. for facebook i had to push highs pretty hard coz their compression “eats” lots of highs, one can hear it here (already corected) still quiet harsh….

    #95329
    Profile photo of Eric
    Eric
    Participant

    Yes the audio delay was a small value but it was both correct and noticeable while viewing the live stream. I have a media clip (with both visual and audio cues) that I play on a laptop for example. Then I actually film the media clip that is playing on the laptop using our entire signal chain in a live stream. All I then have to do is watch the live stream and I can see the exact amount of audio delay. The visual and audio cues will be out of sync and it is visually indicated exactly how many ms the adjustment needs to be. Works great.
    Tomorrow night we have music practice and I will take a picture of the monitor mix structure so it will be easy to see. Just like you would have 5 in-ear mixes for the musicians, I have 5 in-ear mixes with a sixth in-ear mix that is routed to the YouTube/Facebook. There is a configuration value that is allowed for delay but I believe it will be applied to all six of the in-ear mixes. Not just the one for YouTube/Facebook.

    #95330
    Profile photo of Eric
    Eric
    Participant

    I have included 2 attachments from our ATEM and there is no option that I know of for delay. The newer ATEM mini Pro’s I am told have an option to input delay, but the older models don’t. I am told the newer models have a different chip architecture that allows for delayed audio. At least that is my current understanding of the issue.
    I am told mix minus involves the use of two cameras where I choose to use the audio from only one camera. I ignore the audio from the second camera. I then use video clips from both cameras and include the audio from only the specified camera.

    #95331
    Profile photo of Eric
    Eric
    Participant

    I will try again to upload files. I cannot get the second file in a small enough size.

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    #95337
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    I’m not clear whether you’re trying to add the delay you want from the desk or from you computer.
    If it’s from the desk though, you say:

    I have 5 in-ear mixes with a sixth in-ear mix that is routed to the YouTube/Facebook. There is a configuration value that is allowed for delay but I believe it will be applied to all six of the in-ear mixes.

    So are you in ear mixes from 5 (or 6) mixes on the desk, or do you use an ME system?
    Desk mixes all have independent delay values – one will not affect another.

    ME – I’m not that familiar with, but I don’t believe you can add delay to the output – so you’ll either need to add it within your computer, or maybe get creative by routing it back through the desk to another output.

    #95338
    Profile photo of Mike C
    Mike C
    Participant

    What you ATEM attachment show is the old control software.

    Have you looked to see if there is firmware update for the ATEM model you have that would then let you use the newer version control software?
    All the new ATEM Mini series will let you add delay to the external audio inputs on the switcher.

    I’m still not quite following your mixer set up description either.
    Each mix out can have independent delay added, so if the 6th mix/aux is only feeding
    the live stream any output processing will apply to that mix, in a normal routing config.

    #95355
    Profile photo of Eric
    Eric
    Participant

    I have updated to the latest software for our ATEM Television Studio HD and there is no provision for delay on our model. As I mentioned I am told the older models do not have an architecture that allow delay.
    I am enclosing a “monitor outputs.jpg” that shows some of our monitor outputs. I simply want to add delay to the FaceBL output. As you can see in the “Facebook.jpg” there is no delay value available for the monitor output. I am only showing the Compressor but nothing is available on the EQ tabs either. I could add an insert and use an FX but I don’t believe there is any effect available that will simply allow me to delay the entire signal. I might be wrong about that though. The only delay that I can add is on the “PAFL.jpg” which I assume is added to all the monitor outputs.
    I assume at this point I am going to have to learn how to use a matrix as that seems to be the only way to add delay to a monitor output.
    No we do not use an ME system

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    #95360
    Profile photo of MarkPAman
    MarkPAman
    Participant

    Not got the desk set up, but here it is in the app:

    SQ - Delay on Aux Output

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