Main Output Limiter

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This topic contains 12 replies, has 6 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of dnxmirrorsounds dnxmirrorsounds 8 years, 10 months ago.

Viewing 13 posts - 1 through 13 (of 13 total)
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  • #23268
    Profile photo of pealsound
    pealsound
    Participant

    The limiter on the main output only works on physical outputs, SPDIF and TRS Jacks on the surface – and XLR on the MixRack.

    I use my iLive for recording, and need to feed my stereo balance to:

    a) Matrixes – an attenuated feed for distribution to recorders which can’t take full line level and also broadcast PPM meters which have to show -18dB as 4PPM

    b) Local Monitor – via PAFL section, for control room monitors.

    These two paths pick up the mix BEFORE the limiter so I can’t hear, or meter the limiting.

    Of course, I never use the limiter, but there are times I’d find it handy. Is there a work around, or am I missing something?

    Cheers
    Jerry

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card

    #31213
    Profile photo of Dave
    Dave
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by pealsound


    How about sending the mix through a group and use the limiter on the group?

    Not sure why you need a limiter on the recording mix unless you’re running your levels high, but couldn’t you do the same there?

    Of course this depends on your configuration having enough groups available.

    iDr48/T-112/MADI

    #31214
    Profile photo of pealsound
    pealsound
    Participant

    Thanks dburris

    I’m already using some groups as part of my mix. You can’t route groups to other groups can you?

    You ask why I need a limiter on the recording. I work in broadcast and it’s always a live mix, straight to stereo. I’m often giving the audio to editors who don’t have time or equipment to deal with a wide dynamic range – they just need it loud enough, but not too loud.

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card

    #31215
    Profile photo of RayS
    RayS
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by pealsound

    The limiter on the main output only works on physical outputs, SPDIF and TRS Jacks on the surface – and XLR on the MixRack.

    I use my iLive for recording, and need to feed my stereo balance to:

    a) Matrixes – an attenuated feed for distribution to recorders which can’t take full line level and also broadcast PPM meters which have to show -18dB as 4PPM

    b) Local Monitor – via PAFL section, for control room monitors.

    These two paths pick up the mix BEFORE the limiter so I can’t hear, or meter the limiting.

    Of course, I never use the limiter, but there are times I’d find it handy. Is there a work around, or am I missing something?

    Cheers
    Jerry

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card


    perhaps I am misunderstanding your question but could you not just use the matrices’ limiters ???

    Ray

    #31216
    Profile photo of pealsound
    pealsound
    Participant

    Hi RayS

    Yes, in theory I could use the matrix limiters, but I’m using 3 different matrixes (2 analog recorders and the PPM meters) so it’s not ideal – I’d be recording something I couldn’t easily monitor. And it still doesn’t sort out the loudspeaker monitoring via the PAFL section.

    It would be so much easier if the limiter was in the right place on the mix bus!

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card

    #31217
    Profile photo of RayS
    RayS
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by pealsound

    Hi RayS

    Yes, in theory I could use the matrix limiters, but I’m using 3 different matrixes (2 analog recorders and the PPM meters) so it’s not ideal – I’d be recording something I couldn’t easily monitor. And it still doesn’t sort out the loudspeaker monitoring via the PAFL section.

    It would be so much easier if the limiter was in the right place on the mix bus!

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card


    if your mains feed the matrices then all these matrices will be post limiter/eq/comp etc,from the main L_R …..also solving your pafl problem since you would be monitoring post fader etc….??!!

    RayS

    R-72/iDR32/iPS10

    #31218
    Profile photo of pealsound
    pealsound
    Participant

    Amazingly, NO. That’s the nub of the problem Ray. The limiter gets left out of the chain if the main output is going to a matrix. Strange but true…

    Or I’m an idiot and doing something odd?

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card

    #31219
    Profile photo of ddff_lv
    ddff_lv
    Participant

    I believe there can be just one limiter and only at the end of signal path. Like in any speaker processor. Because it is not a part of dynamic processing, but a mechanism for protection.

    ddff

    #31220
    Profile photo of pealsound
    pealsound
    Participant

    Hmmmm – still doesn’t explain the PAFL monitor problem. It would be nice if there was an option to over-ride this. I think I’ll have to make a suggestion to A&H.

    Cheers all

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card

    #31221
    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    It should be possible to monitor the limiter with pressing the coresponding select.
    The limiters in iLive are mainly for protection…
    You can configure the compressor for needs.
    The auto modes are taylored for such tasks you have.

    SRV-AVB
    R-72, iDR-16, xDR-16, Dante

    #31222
    Profile photo of pealsound
    pealsound
    Participant

    steffenromeiss and ddff_lv both point out that the limiters are for “protection”. I’m trying to “protect” my recording from digital clipping or “overs”.

    I successfully produce workable balanced recordings using the dynamics sections on input channels and groups and the main output compressor. The occasional audience member clapping extra loud will not cause a PPM meter to go above 6 (maximum) but may reach 0dB on the digital scale which gives a little red light on all digital meters. Whilst that in itself is not a major problem, it would be nice to be able to control these peaks.

    IDR48 – T112 – Dante card

    #31225
    Profile photo of ddff_lv
    ddff_lv
    Participant

    In order to protect mix from clipping I suggest to use compressor with appropriate settings. You should be able to replicate limiter with all the controls you have.

    ddff

    #31232
    Profile photo of dnxmirrorsounds
    dnxmirrorsounds
    Participant

    I thought it worked as I use compression and limiting on our record buss although I don’t use LR to record but I have a separate Post fade stereo Aux with all the faders set to 0dB which I then route to OB, the CDR and Parent’s Room via matrices as appropriate.

    I will check out the LR limiter just to satisfy my curiosity next time I am in front of it…

    Duncan Whitcombe
    @Dnxmirrorsounds
    Mirror Sounds & metrochurch
    Perth, Australia
    T112, iDR48x2
    http://www.mirrorsounds.com.au
    http://www.metrochurch.org.au

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