General Pre purchase questions

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This topic contains 10 replies, has 9 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Mr-B Mr-B 10 years, 2 months ago.

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  • #22632
    Profile photo of luces
    luces
    Participant

    Good day and thanks for the forums. I am hoping to glean a bit more info and some pre purchase guidance. All help is greatly appreciated.

    We are a live band that plays approx 210 gigs a year and we play small pubs to big outdoor festivals. Some of these gigs are semi permanent and some are one nighters. We need a system with FOH Mix and four seperate monitor mixes. We are all using in ear monitors.

    We need at least 24 channels of ins and mixing capability. We are considering the R72 desk and the iDR32 mixrack.

    Now to the questions:Regarding the R72 and the system in general:

    1 My understanding is that the Cat5 only handles commands from the R72 and does not actually send/rec. audio. Is that correct?

    2 If so, how does the FOH hear audio when he is soloing an instrument?

    3 How many FX engines are included in the iDR32? I use the term engines because I am familiar with the Yamaha 01V96 as that is our current console. We need a minimum of 3 Stereo FX Processors. Is the iDR32 capable of this?

    4 We are currently using a MixWizard for our monitor board and while it is great we would like to get rid of it. So what do we need to run monitors on stage? Do we need another surface or would the PL remotes work for us?

    5 If we decide to keep the MixWizard,could we just send direct outs from the iDR32 into the MixWizard?

    I am sure that I will have more questions as I study the possibilties more,however,I think this is all I can think of for now.

    So based on the provided info,would someone please suggest a simple and complete system for our needs?

    Thanks VERY much!!!!

    luces

    #27331
    Profile photo of CMattE
    CMattE
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by luces

    Good day and thanks for the forums. I am hoping to glean a bit more info and some pre purchase guidance. All help is greatly appreciated.

    We are a live band that plays approx 210 gigs a year and we play small pubs to big outdoor festivals. Some of these gigs are semi permanent and some are one nighters. We need a system with FOH Mix and four seperate monitor mixes. We are all using in ear monitors.

    We need at least 24 channels of ins and mixing capability. We are considering the R72 desk and the iDR32 mixrack.

    Now to the questions:Regarding the R72 and the system in general:

    1 My understanding is that the Cat5 only handles commands from the R72 and does not actually send/rec. audio. Is that correct?

    2 If so, how does the FOH hear audio when he is soloing an instrument?

    3 How many FX engines are included in the iDR32? I use the term engines because I am familiar with the Yamaha 01V96 as that is our current console. We need a minimum of 3 Stereo FX Processors. Is the iDR32 capable of this?

    4 We are currently using a MixWizard for our monitor board and while it is great we would like to get rid of it. So what do we need to run monitors on stage? Do we need another surface or would the PL remotes work for us?

    5 If we decide to keep the MixWizard,could we just send direct outs from the iDR32 into the MixWizard?

    I am sure that I will have more questions as I study the possibilties more,however,I think this is all I can think of for now.

    So based on the provided info,would someone please suggest a simple and complete system for our needs?

    Thanks VERY much!!!!

    luces


    1&2. Actually the ACE cable carries audio and control information.(ACE stands for Audio Control over Ethernet) While all of the audio is processed in the Mixrack there are inputs and outputs on the control surfaces.

    3. You can have up to 8 stereo effects units.

    4. Several options here. If you hook up a wireless router you can use an iPad with the MixPad app or any laptop running the editor software to control it. You could also use the PL remotes, but I think the other options will be more useful.

    5. Yes you could, but I think you’ll find the mix wizard unnecessary, but they are nice little mixers for sure.

    Oh and fwiw I don’t have an iLive system yet. Just looking around and learning until ours gets here. I would highly suggest downloading the editor software and trying it out. It may take a bit to get a handle on, but once you do you’ll begin to understand just how cool these systems can be. Also as far as a complete system goes. It’s my understanding you can actually run the MixRack with just a laptop. So a control surface isn’t even required, but for most people it would be worth the investment. Our church is planning on getting a T112/48 system and I plan on running monitors from the stage with laptop and maybe eventually an iPad. Should easily cover all our needs.

    Looking at a T112/48. :-)

    #27333
    Profile photo of ceejay
    ceejay
    Participant

    In this concept, think of any control surface such as an R72 surface in your case, laptop or ipad as basically just a controller for the mix rack. You may find that a laptop or ipad will be just fine for your monitors or even running FOH in certain situations. The mix rack has separate ethernet ports for laptops, routers, etc. The ACE port is where you would connect the R72 surface using cat 5.
    Regarding solo instruments or PAFL, You will clearly have that capability on the R72 surface.
    You will not have that ability when running a laptop or ipad as a surface, but there are alternative methods to that via an IEM transmitter/receiver.

    Luces, your looking at a fine system that you will very happy with and enjoy, and certainly be a proud owner. The learning curve is very short, and the logical layout is everything to be desired in a digital system. If your musicians are on IEM’s, the tonal quality will be a significant improvement over the mixwizard. That is one less piece of gear in your system and no multicore needed. Good luck with your search, and welcome to the family if you choose those components.

    CRJ
    Oswego, IL

    T112 Surface
    iDR48 Mix Rack
    Sony F Series laptop
    Win 7 500GB HD 8G RAM
    iPad 2 and Dante soon

    #27335
    Profile photo of RayS
    RayS
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by luces

    Good day and thanks for the forums. I am hoping to glean a bit more info and some pre purchase guidance. All help is greatly appreciated.

    We are a live band that plays approx 210 gigs a year and we play small pubs to big outdoor festivals. Some of these gigs are semi permanent and some are one nighters. We need a system with FOH Mix and four seperate monitor mixes. We are all using in ear monitors.

    We need at least 24 channels of ins and mixing capability. We are considering the R72 desk and the iDR32 mixrack.

    Now to the questions:Regarding the R72 and the system in general:

    1 My understanding is that the Cat5 only handles commands from the R72 and does not actually send/rec. audio. Is that correct?

    2 If so, how does the FOH hear audio when he is soloing an instrument?

    3 How many FX engines are included in the iDR32? I use the term engines because I am familiar with the Yamaha 01V96 as that is our current console. We need a minimum of 3 Stereo FX Processors. Is the iDR32 capable of this?

    4 We are currently using a MixWizard for our monitor board and while it is great we would like to get rid of it. So what do we need to run monitors on stage? Do we need another surface or would the PL remotes work for us?

    5 If we decide to keep the MixWizard,could we just send direct outs from the iDR32 into the MixWizard?

    I am sure that I will have more questions as I study the possibilties more,however,I think this is all I can think of for now.

    So based on the provided info,would someone please suggest a simple and complete system for our needs?

    Thanks VERY much!!!!

    luces


    Hey Luces, we’re presently on tour with just the set-up you describe….i.e. R-72 and iDR32 mixrack monitors from the same mixrack sharing pre amp gain but with separate trims….monitors from a pc (wired ) and a mac (wireless), its works beautifully, you probably won’t need the mixwizard …..with the ipad its even better……

    hope this helps

    Ray

    RayS

    R-72/iDR32/iPS10

    #27343
    Profile photo of abstractnoise
    abstractnoise
    Participant

    To add some details:

    2) FOH hears solo audio that’s fed to the surface over the CAT5 cable along with the control signals and other local audio input/output on the desk. So you can plug in a CD player etc at FOH, or take recordings/local aux feeds from it. We do this all the time and it works flawlessly and sounds great.

    4) You could use PL remotes, but a laptop running the iLive editor over WiFi or even a dedicated CAT5 cable will be just fine. We do this for more advanced setups and it’s worked out just fine.

    5) Lose the MixWizard and you’ll make life much easier and cleaner. If you carry separate FOH/Mons engineers, feel free to use two surfaces, or just one surface at FOH and give Mons engineer a laptop as described above.

    Our iLive has been a real asset, allowing us to run all processing and FX in the board, as well as limiting/EQ/basic crossovers on matrix outputs to manage the system. Learning our way around the system took about a day from a “design and admin” perspective, with most users just needing assistance for the first soundcheck or two to find their way around.

    Enjoy! :)

    Work web: http://www.allsouls.org
    Home web: http://abstractnoise.co.uk

    #27344
    Profile photo of Biggsounds
    Biggsounds
    Participant

    Also, check out the videos at http://www.allen-heath.com/ilive/videos
    Particularly numbers 6&7 – these certainly helped me make the leap of faith!

    iDR32 mixrack
    MixRack for iPad & Tweak for iPhone apps
    Asus N61 Laptop (x2 wireless)
    Sennheiser IEM (for PFL)
    Dante card (soon!)

    #27347
    Profile photo of ThomasL
    ThomasL
    Participant

    Regarding the statement of abstractnoise:
    It is not a good idea to use two surfaces on one mixrack, for this config you’d need two mixracks and two consoles.
    But for what luces is planning, the setup with R72, iDR32 and a Laptop / Mixpad is great. The tricky part is, that you only have one PAFL-Bus, so if you have one engineer for FoH and one for Monitors, they have to share the PAFL, if one hits the button, the other hears the same thing. If you’re a touring band with an foh guy and you do your own monitors, the above mentionend config is fine.

    Regards,

    Thomas

    In Use & For Rent
    iLive T112 / iDR48
    http://www.lange-ohlemeyer.de
    http://www.lange-ohlemeyer.de/blog

    #27351
    Profile photo of simonstpauli
    simonstpauli
    Participant

    quote:


    Originally posted by luces
    4 We are currently using a MixWizard for our monitor board and while it is great we would like to get rid of it. So what do we need to run monitors on stage? Do we need another surface or would the PL remotes work for us?


    I had very good results with (4) PL-10 remotes for a band on a tour I was mixing. You can control 8 channels (or groups) to a mix, that can be configured freely. In my case it was a different setup for every band member, tailored to their control preference.

    Regarding the groups: it is possible to route channels to a group and send that group to auxes. This is handy for grouping channels together that don’t need to be controlled seperately for a mix.

    I had every channel split, using 30 input channels, 30 monitor split channels and 2 ambience channels.

    So for monitor you can use PL-10 remotes or the new mixpad app, when you already have iPads.

    Christian Tepfer
    Hamburg, Germany

    #27363
    Profile photo of luces
    luces
    Participant

    Wow!!! Thanks for all of the great info. This is very encouraging. Also, I had no idea that there were so many users using such killer systems!!! You guys are SICK!!!!! I love it.

    Thanks again,and keep it coming. I will continue to research and hopefully soon, I will have a killer system!

    Thanks,

    luces

    #27364
    Profile photo of Biggsounds
    Biggsounds
    Participant

    luces, I’d say 4 iPads with the mix pad app would be ideal for your setup – everyone controls their own feed to the ears, and you can get a mount to attach the iPad to a stand so it’s not intrusive or hard to position (plus – no cables!). Of course the beauty of having a system like this for your band is that you’ll have absolute recall-ability and the capability of saving programs to suit your regular venues – saves a huge amount of time on setup!
    I haven’t checked if its on that video page, but there was a great video also of an engineer with a Motown band saying some of their corporate work comes from the fact that they have such a small footprint (no stage monitors, no FOH console (using a wireless laptop), and a single rack holding their mix rack & ears transmitters) – very clean and easy for designers to fit into an event! You might even see some more work from having this type of rig ;)

    iDR32 mixrack
    MixRack for iPad & Tweak for iPhone apps
    Asus N61 Laptop (x2 wireless)
    Sennheiser IEM (for PFL)
    Dante card (soon!)

    #27366
    Profile photo of Mr-B
    Mr-B
    Participant

    Wow!!! Thanks for all of the great info. This is very encouraging. Also, I had no idea that there were so many users using such killer systems!!! You guys are SICK!!!!! I love it.

    I am so sorry you gentlemen are all unwell, I do hope it soon passes, strange that someone would be happy at your illness. Still I suspect it takes all sorts.[:D]

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