Search Results for 'qu midi protocol'

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Viewing 15 results - 1 through 15 (of 198 total)
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  • #101399

    In reply to: AHM TCP/IP Protocol

    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant

    I found the documentation about the protocol “AHM TCP Protocol V1” but no sample code in any programming language.

    What are you talking about? It’s just plain MIDI over TCP…

    #100354
    Profile photo of Mfk0815
    Mfk0815
    Participant

    what would be really helpful to understand is where/why this ‘faderless SQ’ would be used. i.e. why would this be chosen for use over an SQ-5 or Qu-Pac/Qu-SB?

    Hmm, before we can discuss a faderless, rack version of the SQ. We should talk about a better and flexible integration of mixers to a more complex system. Maybe you should start to look over the border of the A&H dish and see what other companies do with their products. Ok, maybe you think that others cannot do that job as well or even better than A&H, but there are a lot of things you can learn imho.
    First of all, I am missing two build in SLink connectors. I know, there is an option card to add a second one, but that will avoid using Dante or Waves. Two build in allows you to use stageboxes and connect to another mixing console at the same time, or allow you to connect one console with two other consoles. Sample: Monitor console with DX Stageboxes <-> FOH console <-> Streaming console.
    Second, add the possibility to remote control the head amps of the local sockets or the one of aconnected stage box by a second console. This eould allow us to control the head amps of the monitor console and the connected stageboxes via the FOH Console. This will allow us to use an second, unattended, SQ as Stagebox and IEM Mixer which head amps can be controlled by Operator at the FOH console.
    Additionally there is a need of a full featured remote app to control every aspect of the console In online and offline mode. The best solution is that this app is available for at least Windows, Mac, Linux, iOS and Android. Support of a hardware control protocol like MCU and a better Midi implementation will allow the user to do the job even without physical access to the console.
    Then it would be time to think about a surface less reckmount console either with local IO like the QU-SB or even a version with very limited IO, some inputs for playback music, a monitor and headphone out.

    #100271
    Profile photo of KeithJ A&H
    KeithJ A&H
    Moderator

    @mike@SCS – You are correct that there are some MIDI messages which are only available using MIDI over TCP/IP, including get system state.

    It is possible to use MIDI over TCP/IP to communicate between the Qu and Windows (or Mac), though for a stand-alone program you will need to implement active sensing as described here – https://www.allen-heath.com/media/Qu_MIDI_Protocol_V1.9.pdf#page=2&zoom=auto,-274,185

    Another option would be to make use of ‘MIDI Thru’ with A&H MIDI Control – https://www.allen-heath.com/midi-control/ – this provides a managed connection between the Qu and Windows (or Mac!) and you can then send and receive messages using the virtual MIDI ports created.

    Hope this helps!
    Keith.

    #100269
    Profile photo of Mike@SCS
    Mike@SCS
    Participant

    In my program (which runs only under Windows) I can successfully control channel mutes, etc on my QU16 using USB MIDI. However, I would also like to use Sysex messages such as ‘Get System State’, but when I try to send this message I get no response back from the QU16. Looking at the MIDI Protocol Manual I note that this is listed below info about a TCP device connection. Are these Sysex messages only available via TCP MIDI? Can I use these in a Windows environment? I’ve tried without success.

    #100224
    Profile photo of SignalAudio
    SignalAudio
    Participant

    Hi there,

    I use the TCP MIDI protocol a lot for automation from third party devices, and often need to fade up and down different sources. This ends up being quite a clunky thing to code into the controlling device as differences in fade duration require different arrays of 16-bit preset values (per the linear taper in the MIDI protocol documentation).

    What would help greatly is knowing the mathematical relationship between the decibel value and the 16-bit linear taper value. This would mean I could program my devices to calculate the target value on the run. I’ve tried to suss it out and my wife – a statistician – couldn’t even get a particularly accurate coefficient with her clever software.

    Would A&H be happy to furnish us with this? It would apply more broadly than SQ of course.

    Many thanks!

    #99534
    Profile photo of Dilettant
    Dilettant
    Participant

    @volunteer

    You are getting more and more ridiculous now.

    I can go to any hardware store and buy some USB Storage hardware and in 99,9% of the cases that will work out of the Box with Win10, Mac, Linux, any BSD flavour, my VW Car Radio, my Android tablet and almost any other thing that needs USB storage out there. The only thing i have to care of is that it is big enough and fast enough for the task.

    There are some really evil broken devices out there, but chances to get one in a shop are really low, especially when leaving out the cheap thumb drives. By far most of the available USB Storage devices sold work very well with most common USB Hosts.

    In Fact, best case chances that a bought USB Storage device will work with SQ Drive are around 30% even if i leave out thumb drives and devices that are too slow by specs or generally problematic according to widespread test results.

    If i counted right, from 8 common available SSD Drives with 500GB and up in the List of this Forum Thread 6 are reported to have massive Problems with SQ Drive. For 1TB SSDs only 2 are reported to work sometimes at all. 80% of the List mentions devices that are even historic and no more available to buy in regular stores.

    Just sort by capacity and scroll down the list and see how many red there is in the last column!. And then strike out Hard Disks (which are really ancient now for such a task) and any device that is not actually available in stores now.

    That might be ok if the SQ Mixers were out of stock since 10 Years. But as long as i can buy one at almost any bigger audio hardware store that is simply inacceptable.

    So it has to be clearly stated that varying device implementations can not be the main Problem here. Facts let little doubt SQ/Qu Drive is.

    If other central functions in that Mixers would work as bad (for example, the Mic Inputs would not work with 80% of the available Microphones) for sure customers would slap that desks around A&H dealers’ faces all the day.

    That does not happen – mainly, because the Workaround to use a Notebook for Recording works well. Most other Mixers in that price range can’t multitrack “on board” at all or have more embarassing caveats. And because massive Multitracking might be not a very important functionality for many SQ/Qu Users at all.

    The real founding of the disaster is also not so difficult to identify. A&H did not use widely available known to work USB libs since they have not included any general purpose Computer in the SQ/Qu. Instead, they made their own implementation of supported USB Protocols as a self-developed FPGA Solution.

    The audio part of that seems to be really good. Maybed the developers had much more experience and references on that, maybe this part is much more easy, maybe it is just older code and thus, better tested. I don’t know about the USB/MIDI part since i did not use that yet.

    But the Mass Storage part is simply a disaster for now. They tried to reinvent the wheel and ended up with some cubic thing that only can roll on specially plastered ways but they even don’t know where such ways are available, how to build such a plaster or who can do that.

    I could bet if they instead had integrated some small computer Hardware like a Raspi for such tasks into the Mixer, in sum that would have gone cheaper since their FPGA developers then could focus on the good working USB Audio/MIDI part and they could use already available free Software libraries for the Mass Storage part or even outsource that. It had also some more benefits not at focus here, for example supporting more audio file formats for playback.

    Without that hardware, they had to create their own Mass Storage implementation on FPGA. That includes an USB-supported Filesystem (FAT32) and since BOT isn’t sufficient for Multitracking they also need UAS what has a bunch of subprotocols down to the ATA/SCSI Command set. That is a lot of complex work.

    However, even that could be done well (some day). For the Moment it definitely isn’t. SQ Drive is dysfunctionally broken with most in reality available Storage devives and even according to A&H there is no way to reliably order a storage device that will definitely work at all.

    A&H could at least offer or “certify” some big USB Mass Storage devices itself. I think customers even would pay a 20% additional fee for such one if they can be sure it works then.

    It is revealing that they even don’t do that. Instead, they say explicitly “we implemented something but even ourself don’t know what you need to buy to get it working”. That maybe acceptable fore some Kosmos Radio Experimenting set aimed at 14 year old pupils starting their Nerd Career, it definitely is not at all for professional Audio Gear.

    #98529
    Profile photo of Sengstake
    Sengstake
    Participant

    Hello Nicola,
    thank you for your help so far. I´m also in contact with Visual Productions(CueCore2 manufacturer) to get this to work.

    To clarify the solution you supposed:

    I will set the Preset in AHM-64 with a spare input channel for dimmer controls. On recalling this preset the string will be sent over TCP with an NRPM message, am I right?
    CueCore2 is quite open with their protocols and can understand some TCP strings aswell. Maybe I dont need the middle man “A&H MIDI Control” on a PC/Mac?
    Both products have GPI/Os so there will be a solution. But a clean over the network install is desired.

    Thing is with this solution that there is still no “real time fader value over TCP”, am I getting this right aswell?

    Having the customer and the design process in mind rhis would mean the following???

    `Set your desired scene with dimmers
    recall the preset
    don’t like the dimming values?
    set again with new dimming values (no immediate effect)
    recall the preset with new dimmer values again to see an effect
    `
    So no real time fader cahnges in Custom Control app, but a way to change dimming values out of the AHM-64/Custom Control app and send over TCP to CueCore2???

    I will try the computer solution tomorrow when I have access to the AHM-64 again.

    Thank you for your time Nicola!
    Cheers
    Jan

    #98409
    Profile photo of Nicola A&H
    Nicola A&H
    Keymaster

    Hi Sengstake,

    The External Control in AHM-64 was designed for simple commands to trigger projectors or video switchers, not as a substitute to dedicated control systems like Crestron or similar. There isn’t a way to pass on variables like fader position to a specific IP address / TCP port. My recommendation here would be to adopt a third party control system.

    Alternatively, you could use the AHM-64 own TCP port to ‘read’ the level of a spare input channel, and program a piece of software to translate this NRPN message (detailed in the TCP protocol document) to a MIDI / OSC message you can send to the CueCore. For example, a computer running A&H MIDI Control (to expose the AHM messages on a virtual MIDI port) and something like Bome’s MIDI Translator can be set up this way, but will require some knowledge of MIDI and programming efforts.

    #98397
    Profile photo of Sengstake
    Sengstake
    Participant

    Hello Hive Mind,
    before writing a ticket and consulting my local distributor in the night about this issue I wanted to ask this place for some advice
    First off I tried the search term ahm 64 with a smacking 15 results. my hopes are higher than that number.

    we have some presets already set up in the Manage tab of the AHM System Manager 1.02. Now for external control I use TCP to pass some commands to a CueCore2 light controller
    triggering Playbacks and Cues on that device to align the audio presets with the lighting scenes works fine.

    my question is how do i manage to pass a fader or channel value to the CueCore2 (that has a TCP API already, code is pretty easy: core-pb-1-intensity=<channel value as float>)

    for our contractor I want to build a GUI in the iOS App where the lights should be dimmed with a virtual fader same as audio levels.

    In the Manage/Presets tab I am not able to see a solution to pass a variable via UDP/TCP
    Sure is, a Preset is recalled and UDP/TCP code gets send via network and received by CueCore2, this works fine already! But it’s only sent once.
    But how to control non static more dynamic funtions of any 3rd party UDP/TCP devices ???

    The CueCore2 also supports MIDI and OSC protocols, so not necessarily UDP/TCP is needed. Is there another way to solve this issue

    I really don´t want to sell my contractor something like this

    Audio Preset 1 with 100% light intensity
    Audio Preset 1 with 50% light intensity
    Audio Preset 1 with 25% light intensity
    Audio Preset 2 with 100% light intensity
    Audio Preset 2 with 50% light intensity
    Audio Preset ...

    nor do i want to program this as presets.

    So…how do I get a fader value transmitted via network in. real. time.?

    #97551
    Profile photo of KeithJ A&H
    KeithJ A&H
    Moderator

    @nottooloud

    The 3rd party control drivers (Crestron, AMX, Extron, Neets) all make use of MIDI as this is our only public protocol.
    Proprietary network control protocols are not public however and also often change with major firmware revisions (hence why the app and firmware versions must match).

    SQ MIDI’s protocol includes Level, Pan and Assignment for around 2000 parameter numbers (addresses), so about 6000 controls with high resolution control of levels (16384 steps). In addition, there is complete Mute, Soft Key and Scene control. There is also toggle options for switches, relative control options (e.g. ±1dB) and get methods to return the current value.
    Worth noting here is that the inclusion of Soft Key control in the protocol is to enable remote/automatic ‘by-proxy’ control of many more parameters.

    Please put any requests for other MIDI control in the ‘feature suggestions’ area though so they can be discussed and considered for future updates.
    (I personally really hoped for MIDI Clock -> Global Tap but as it was not possible directly, I just use virtual Soft Key taps instead)

    Cheers,
    Keith.

    #97526
    Profile photo of nottooloud
    nottooloud
    Participant

    @keithjah

    I’d love to see someone write a Companion module. I’ve gotten a lot of use out of the X32 module.
    A&H website says:
    Documentation for the mixing systems, including specifications of the TCP/IP protocols can be found here:
    but that SQ link just wraps back to the SQ product page.
    3rd Party Control page
    Are the control protocols available?
    The available MIDI controls are quite limited.

    #97320

    In reply to: SQ MIDI Protocol

    Profile photo of SteffenR
    SteffenR
    Participant
    #97314
    Profile photo of Bruce
    Bruce
    Participant

    @alex,

    Have you created a spreadsheet for the SQ like the one you did for the QU?

    #96387
    Profile photo of StevenGeertsQU16
    StevenGeertsQU16
    Participant

    Dear all,

    I did get the immpression that it is possible to record track is Garageband from inststrument/mic’s that are connected to a QU16 (in my case). However, for me it doesn’t seem to work. I think I have the correct setup and setting but still no go. This is what I have:
    -QU16 (latest software build available)
    -Global USB B Streaming is set
    -The USB cable is connecte to my MAC (El Capitan)
    -CH2 patched to USB
    -I/O Patch untouched so 2 = CH2
    On the MAC I have installed the DAW controller
    -Mixer QU Series
    -MidiChannel2
    -Protocol: Mackie Control
    -Midi Ports radio button selected
    -Input Port: QU-16 Midi Out
    -Output Port: QU-16 Midi In
    When I move a fader on the QU, the square box in the lower right corner of the DAW control start turning black so I now the connection is establisht.
    When looking into the MAC’s Midi Setup I can see the QU-16 and all the in- and output channels. QU-16 is selected and the sample freqency is set to 48Khz. CLock source is QU-16 Audio

    In Garageband then, I add a new Audio track and select input 2 and Listing to QU-16

    When all this is completed, I would assume that talking into the mic on channel 2 that is unmuted would result in some kind of signal. But nothing happens. On the QU I can not even see an input signal. When I swith from USB to normal, I do have sound and input level volume. Back to USB…all is mute.

    Can someone please help……

    #95578
    Profile photo of KeithJ A&H
    KeithJ A&H
    Moderator

    Hi @uselessoldman,

    There is no way for the DAW to ‘see’ the mixing functions (or FX as you suggest) and no way for the Qu to ‘see’ the DAW.
    But to explain further, the MIDI capabilities of the Qu can be split into two parts:

    • MIDI control to and from the mixing core which mostly uses NRPN messaging (as detailed in the MIDI Protocol – https://www.allen-heath.com/media/Qu_MIDI_Protocol_V1.9.pdf). This is intended for control of the mixer or recording of automation for control of the mixer. Something to be clear with here is that the messaging goes to and from the core, so it works in parallel to the surface controls i.e. moving a rotary would send a message to the change a parameter in the core which would then send a MIDI message, so the message would not be being sent from the rotary itself.
    • MIDI channel strips and SoftKey options. These do send messages from the physical controls on the surface and are not linked to the audio mixing core.

    Use of the Qu as a DAW Control Surface uses MIDI channels strips and SoftKeys, taking standard MIDI CC and note on/off messages and converting them to emulate either HUI or MCU protocols.
    The Mute, Sel and PAFL keys for each strip work as Mute, Select and Solo for each DAW channel, and the physical fader will control DAW channel level.
    Alongside this, there are SoftKey options for bank up/down and MMC control.
    This is all bidirectional too, so the motorised faders will follow your DAW, as will the LED’s showing selected channel, mute and solos.

    All of this is just MIDI though, so of course it can be used however you want.
    We often recommend a MIDI translator (such as Bomes MIDI Translator) if you want to convert one set of messages to another for particular applications.

    Hope this helps!
    Keith.

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